Shotguns and penetrator loads

[Temujin]

Andy, this is not meant to start an argument; I just wandered if you've seen tungsten flachette rounds for a 'gauge? You mentioned a lack of penetration with buck against metallic objects such as a car. In most aspects, you are right about that. But...

Flachette rounds can easily be loaded/maufactured at home, whether legal or not (I'm not sure). Not sure if you know what a flachette round is, but if not, here it is:

Imagine a shotshell loaded not with buck or shot, but 8-21 tungsten darts, all with incredibly acute points and fins to stabilize them in flight. Naturally, they'll rip through any and all body armor, trauma plates included, and may pass entirely through the unfortunate sap wearing body armor. They'll eat through metal car doors like a bb traveling 1200 fps through an aluminum coke can.

They can be made and loaded by just about anyone with a bit of reloading experience. --Cheaply, too, it is just time consuming. Realistically, if you've prepped the tungsten darts and spacers before hand, you could expect to be able to load 20 or more rounds an hour.

Penetration problem solved ;)


-Temujin

[Magnum88C]

I know in FL, and at least one other state flechette (and handgun AP rounds, and the incendiary shotgun rounds) are illegal. It's just a matter of checking state laws before one loads.

[Temujin]

Thank you for correcting my spelling...lol (Flechette) A word I've probably typed a million times correctly before -- where did I come up with "flachette" at? :p


-Temujin

[Magnum88C]

where did I come up with "flachette" at? :p


You have that dream about models in trenchcoats too, eh?

[RIKA]

You have that dream about models in trenchcoats too, eh?

Don't you get the Dillon catalog? :)

RIKA

[Temujin]

You have that dream about models in trenchcoats too, eh?

Doesn't everybody? ;) Unfortunately, mine sometimes turns into a nightmare....

Supermodels in trenchcoats -- all seducing me -- then they just walk away :p

[Magnum88C]

mine sometimes turns into a nightmare....

Supermodels in trenchcoats -- all seducing me -- then they just walk away
I just call that part "real life".

[andy]

No, the darts aint going to penetrate trauma plates, or at least, I doubt it like hell. The military tried flechettes, what they found out was that they usually do NOT tumble iin flesh, so all they do is make minute holes thru the body. real likely to have the guy still kill you, at shotgun type ranges, after you've shot him. The fletchettes don't change the short range of the shotgun (much) dont do a thing about lack of concealment, lack of .22 unit, lack of 1 hand use, slow reloading, small mag capacity, awkward carry of spare ammo, crappy trigger pulls, expense,m wt, bulk of ammo, susceptability of ammo to moisture, oils, rough handling, lack of GI ammo, lack of non-reflective, rust proof finish, lack of easy breakdown for cleaning in the field, lack of flashhider, etc, etc, etc. Shotgun aint worth owning.

[RIKA]

Please post a link to where you get all this info about fletchettes.

RIKA

[Magnum88C]

Don't you get the Dillon catalog? :)

RIKA

You betcha I do!!!


As for the short bus rider, flechettes will go through trauma plates like they aren't there. An individual flechette doesn't do much damage in and of itself, however, they are fin stabilized an maintain a tight pattern, so you're likely going to take most, if not all of the pattern. I believe the longest confirmed kill in Vietnam with a flechette round was in the vicinity of 300 meters, because flechettes hold their pattern.

All of the rest of the "no .22unit," ad nauseum crap is simply irrelevent.