Need a friend for this Challenge

[ABCF]

Everybody loves to go to the range and do what they do best....human nature, right? Here's a drill that I started running awhile back.

Set up one target approximately 7M downrange.

Begin in a two handed boundary setting posture [ie palms out, fingertips up somewhere between midchest and chin level].

Talk to the target. "Get back." "Don't come any closer." "You need to leave."

[This is where a friend comes in very handy and makes for a more realistic test. He can "speak" for the target, forcing you to become more involved in the dialogue. He also will run the timer.]

On the beep, draw and fire one round. Note the time and quality of the hit.

Run the same drill a second time, except as the dialogue gets more involved, establish a one handed grip on the holstered gun while maintaining a one handed boundary setting posture with the nongun hand.

On the beep, draw and fire one round. Note the time and quality of hit.

The last time I ran this exercise, it was in the middle of a south Texas thunderstorm. The shooters were soaked and miserable. All shot from concealment. The skill level ran from an IPSC Master class shooter down to a guy who kept holding the slide of his pistol in his left hand to remove the mag and then hold the pistol by the slide in is right hand to reinsert a fresh mag, then regrasp the gun in his shooting [right] hand, hit the slide release with his left thumb and be ready to shoot again!

Their times from a 2-handed BSP:

1.81
3.01
1.99
1.92
3.45
2.53
2.21
1.98

Their times from 1-hand BSP with grip preestablished:

.86
1.15
1.15
1.09
1.39
1.25
1.31
.81

My times were 1.38 & .66.

The point of the drill is to get people to realize how important establishing a fighting grip on the gun is. Also, to realize the effects that something as simple as talking has on your times. Yet another point to come out of this drill is how much tighter the time range is once grip is established. Also, there is a full 1.64 second spread in the first group. Spread in the second group only ran .58 second.

[Ankeny]

Interesting drill. The distance to the target is critical on something like this drill, especially if you want to grip it and rip it from retention on the one handed portion. There can be a substantial difference in time related in gear too, inspite of what the guys who don't think gear matters will say. What kind of cover garment? Your normal coat that you wear every day? An IDPA gamers "vest" with stiff sides and an extra magazine placed in the right pocket? A Glock 26 deep inside the waistband behind the hip, or full size gun in kydex on the point of the hip? Of course, starting with your hand on the gun levels the playing field considerably and that's the point.

ABCF:

Nice drill. How does it shake out when you do it with movement required? Do most folks draw then move or do they get in motion at the instant the buzzer goes off?

[ABCF]

It depends on their background. "Gamers" tend to appreciate the value in moving. Appropriately trained [IMNSHO:D] people also tend to appreciate the value of moving. Those with no trianing or with textbook "big name" training tend to want to stand and deliver.

Cover garments, in this case, were everything from a US Army goretex parka to Hawaiin shirts [both open and closed front]. In order, everyone except the first two shooters shot from a closed front garment.

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Let's see if I can line out who had what [this is from memory, so bare with me]

Shooter 1 Fullsize Dawson M1911 Hi-Cap from Ky-Tac Braveheart ///Open front Hawaiian shirt for conealment.

Shooter 2 5-inch M1911 9mm from Talon Tactical kydex yaqui slide ///Open front gore-tex rain jacket [From the UK, never worked from a holster prior to this day & fired his first handgun three days before.]

Shooter 3 Glock M19 from a Ted Blcoker LFI iwb rig /// buttondowned Hawaiian shirt

Shooter 4 Glock M19 from a T.T. kydex yaqui slide /// closed front 'business casual' button down [untucked]

Shooter 5 Kahr Mk40 from an unidientified kydex IWB /// closed front buttondown shirt
[multi-hand reload guy]

Shooter 6 Glock 17 from Comp-Tac CTAC kydex IWB /// carthart work jacket

Shooter 7 HK SOCOM from an unidentified kydex IWB!!!!! /// long sleeve t-shirt [tall, slim guy...it actually concealed pretty well!!!!]

Shooter 8 2-tone Glock 17 [olive drab slide] and unidentified leather IWB. /// closed front shirt.
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Going from the one handed BSP does not require that you shoot one handed and most shooters shot from their normal 2-hand mod iso grip. Going from a 2-handed BSP, I saw guys throw shots into the C-zone because they were 'trying to go fast'. There were no non-A-zone hits when going from the establsihed one hand grip and the majority of those were in the upper half of the A-zone, which is my preference.

[Ankeny]

I tried it this morning. My buddy also shot the drill, but he used his Thompson SMG. I think he got off 30 shots in a little ove a second.

I used a Les Baer PII from a Blade Tech holster, unzipped light jacket. The first run was 1.26 seconds. Hand on the pistol was .68 seconds. Your .66 is pretty quick.

[ABCF]

I think it comes from having a disgusting amount of familiarity with the "talking & shooting" aspect of the drill. :D

Across the board, I'm not that fast. But in certain drills, my numbers are surprisinigly consistant and lower than I'd expect.

Also, I was using the same sort of kydex yaqui slide as Shooter #2 [because I wanted him to be able to watch my motions and translate them as closely as possible to his draw.] I normally carry a glock 19 in a leather IWB behind the hip and my times increase with that setup.

Shooter #1 is a much better shooter than I will ever be, but the drill was outside his base of experience, hence the slow times.