Springfield Armory Model 1903, serial # 73xxxx, with Lyman peep sites

[KJUN]

Howdy,

I managed to come across a Springfield Armory Model 1903, serial # 73xxxx, with Lyman peep sites for a price that I feel is pretty fair ($300). I haven't priced these in a few years, but that price seems like a good one to me. Bore looks pretty good, action smooth, etc. I'm gonna test fire it once or twice to see what it shoots like before buying it, but i suspect it'll be in my gun safe soon.

I'm assuming that it SHOULD be safe to fire modern.30-06 ammo out of it since "almost all" '03s were converted to .30-06 once that cartridge was developed. Does anyone need to slap some sense into me or is that still a pretty safe assumption?

Finally, if it never was rechamber (VERY DOUBTFUL), would a .30-06 still chamber properly? If it wasn't and it does, it isn't safe to fire, right? What I'm asking is if there is a way for me to know if it is safe to shoot standard .30-06 rounds or not and am I correct in assuming that almost ALL '03s were converted to .30-06 early last century?

KJ

[RIKA]

KJUN, the rifle is chambered for 30-06. There is a problem that it seems not even experts can agree on. It seems that Springfield Armory rifles with serial numbers below 800,000 received heat treatment of spotty quality and some of them blew up. The experts argue

a) they should never be shot
b) only with reduced loads
c) sparingly with commercial ammo

The experts do agree that the rifles shouldn't be fired with max power handloads and that the action shouldn't be rebarreled for something like 300WinMag.

Here is one link for you to look at:

http://m1903.com/03rcvrfail/

Sorry to rain on your parade but its better that you be aware than take a chance on an unknowing accident. At least at this rate you can make up your mind with things in the open. Maybe even google for other opinions.

RIKA

[KJUN]

Thanks, Rika. You confirmed a lot of what I seemed to be reading (and have read in the past), but I had NOT come acorss that link before. I just finished reading. Not only was it VERY enjoyable to read, but very informative. I like articles that give FACTS and let the reader decide what they think they mean. It really did help a lot!

The experts do agree that the rifles shouldn't be fired with max power handloads and that the action shouldn't be rebarreled for something like 300WinMag.

Yeah, I'm gonna stick with "tame" reloads and no intention of ever modifying the gun further than it is already (after market sites), except MAYBE a scope some time in the future. Who knows? If I ever have to change the barrel, I expect i'll stay with the .30-06 or go down to the .308. NOTHING more powerful.

Sounds like the risk of it blowing up and hurting me with factory loads is pretty darn slim, actually. Once I start reloading for it, I suspect I'll just stick with middle-to-low charges (still overkill for deer where I hunt...lol). Until then, I might even consider the "reduced recoil" loads made by Remington. Good compromise in my opinion, I think.

I've got about a thousand rounds of 1970's milsurp I'd like too use up. I "was" intending to use it up in this gun and then save the brass for reloads for this rifle. I still think it would be "safe enough" to do, but I haven't decided if I will actually do that or not. I'll probably sleep on it, read the article again, and decide....lol.

Great article that puts NUMBERS to many of the things I've read already. Thanks again!
KJ

[RIKA]

If you get the rifle, please show pictures and give a range report. I have a love affair with those beautiful old 1903's.

RIKA :)

[KJUN]

I hope to borrow it tonight before putting some cash down. It looks nice (obviously a lot of the bluing is gone, but no pits were seen, etc.). Bolt works like you'd expect: makes you smile to work the action type thing. Since you like these so much, what's a fair price today for one with after-market sites and not much else chantges, in good condition, with fair rifling? (Supposedly it does under 2 MOA with open sites, and I trust the owner that told me that!) I'll check it tonight in my back yard (2-3 shots) at ~50 yards just to get a group IDEA.....

KJ

[RIKA]

You might point out that its a low number model and that it has been sporterized. That argument might get him down $50 or so. If it shoots good and since you are going to use it for hunting it just depends on how much you want the rifle. A well done sporterized Springy has a certain beauty of its own, at least to me.

RIKA

[KJUN]

I might have written my thoughts wrong. He's a nice older guy (who does know a good bit about guns - a lot more than me on many of the older models!) who just wants to move some of his "stock pile" out. I don't mind the current price, so I'm happy even if I am overpaying. (Repeat: I have no intention of trying to talk him down from the current price.) Since I DO like the guy, I don't want to be underpaying him a bunch. I haven't known him well, but I like him a lot - too much to underpay by a lot. Obviously, I don't mind a good deal, though...lol.

Sounds like a pretty fair price from what you said....and I love the '03s, too. I just don't own one....yet.

[RIKA]

"I don't mind the current price, so I'm happy even if I am overpaying. (Repeat: I have no intention of trying to talk him down from the current price.)"

The honorable thing to do.

RIKA

[ussniper]

Hey guys, What ever you decide, to do just be careful, The 03 springfield is a beutiful piece, but I've heard alot of horror stories on low serial # recievers. I own one my self and its a darn good shooter(high serial #) with a slot in the reciever for the penderson device. But anyway its a great piece of history....USSNIPER

[RIKA]

One of my babys. Lovingly restored to include correct bolt and genuine USMC front sight hood.

RIKA :)

[KJUN]

Very good looking gun, RIKA. Makes me want to get on that hasn't been sporterized...lol. (For the record, this one hasn't been cut down or anything "bad" like that. It just has a "sporter" stock and Lyman sites. I'd love to have one with the original military stock on it, but........

So, as far an update, I shot in my back yard last night. (It is legal, but my neighbors aren't THAT far away, so I typically don't shoot in my yard even though I've got some "safe lanes of fire." (Besides, it wakes up the chickens.....lol.) If they didn't like me firing 2 quick shots, though, they could kiss my butt. Open sites and I only shot 2 rounds from about 45 yards. I was using an archery target as a rest. The 2 holes were touching - looked like one hole from more than 5 feet away. That was promising enough for me to reach for my wallet and pull out some cash without checking to se if fliers are common with more shots. Possible, but I doubt HIGHLY that that will be the case. It was worth the $300 "chance" to me. Needless to say, I'm happy with my new purchase. (The ammo used was .30-06, standard power, Remington soft core lokt factory loads.)

Eventually, I'll work up some "medium light" loads in that milsurp brass (once it gets fired, that is) for this gun. I'm not sure it it'll be a hunting gun or what. I do want to leave it open sites. It might make a good close-in hog gun, though. You can never have too many of those....lol.

[RIKA]

I'm glad it worked out so well. Two holes touching even at 50 yds is a good sign. The Lyman receiver sight just looks "right" on those old guns so I would leave it too. My restored Springy was really a labor of love and something I hope to leave to my child.

RIKA

[KJUN]

Thanks. I haven't decided how far i'm gonna go with it (reblue it or not? et cetera). I kinda like things the way they are. I need to make some "range love" with it soon. :)

[B.FRANKlin]

There once was a Pederson device for sale ($$$$) in David Otipalic's (or something close to that spelling) ads in Shotgun News. Extremely super rare item seldom seen, gone quick and costly. You have to read his ads closely, small print & lotsa stuff. I guess a Springfield '03A3 is in my future (gotta hurry) and a nice Mk.4 #1, and an AK-47, and ===========================on & on. Hope I live long enough.

[Garand]

Beautiful rifle, now you need to buy the book "Hatcher's Notebook". Its the bible for the 1903 and .30-06 wrapped up in 1 package.

[BigJon]

If you get the rifle, please show pictures and give a range report. I have a love affair with those beautiful old 1903's.

RIKA :)

Me too, Rika!!! I have several types of old, military bolt guns, including a shwEET little 1913 I bought from GBullet, but it is my old 1903A3 that is my favorite shooter of all - even including my Garand! If my camera weren't in the shop with something wrong with it, I'd take a photo for you.

Best,
Jon

[BigJon]

I'm glad it worked out so well. Two holes touching even at 50 yds is a good sign. The Lyman receiver sight just looks "right" on those old guns so I would leave it too. My restored Springy was really a labor of love and something I hope to leave to my child.

RIKA

Hell YEA it is! My Garand and 03A3 are what I'd consider reasonably accurate for rack-grade guns, and each come in just about 2 MOA with the ammo they like (and with me being the operator, which may diminish accuracy, my eyes not being' what they usta).

Best,
Jon

[andy]

I'll just never understand that sort of thing. $300 will buy a used Rem M700 that will group twice as well, and in the field, be 4x as likely to hit, because of its much better trigger pull and much faster locktime.

[neolithic hunter]

andy i haven't seen a $300 m700 remington in about 7 yrs. the ones you look at must be junk, if they only want 300 for them. :cool:

[KJUN]

I'll just never understand that sort of thing. $300 will buy a used Rem M700 that will group twice as well, and in the field, be 4x as likely to hit, because of its much better trigger pull and much faster locktime.

I'd put mine up against the average used Rem 700 sold for only $300 any day. :)

I never can understand why someone would sell an illegal product instead of getting a real job. What's the point? Different strokes for different folks. You expect to be able to live your life the way you want, so why can't you let others live their life they way they want? I suspect it is soley because this sick internet persona of yours is an act.

KJ

[BigJon]

I'll just never understand that sort of thing. $300 will buy a used Rem M700 that will group twice as well, and in the field, be 4x as likely to hit, because of its much better trigger pull and much faster locktime.


I understand your perspective, I think, and we've had this conversation before - my recollection was in the context of my grandfather's old LC Smith side-by-side. I think your perspective is focused solely on functionality matters. Mine's that way too for some firearms. However, others I enjoy for more esoteric reasons, and the 03A3 falls into the latter category. I enjoy the "feel" of it (and others, such as the Garand) and also the mere act of shooting and carrying it. I suppose it's because of the history associated with the weapons in the military context, and also because I derive a certain pleasure in walking the woods with a firearm that might have been carried in the woods by folks of earlier generations - the same way one might choose to hunt with a flintlock or other muzzle loader instead of a modern bolt action. Also, the old 03A3 is just fun to shoot.

Best,
Jon