Hand Candy (In Progress)

[BigJon]

Ever heard of "eye candy"? I think that for handguns, maybe I should call it "hand candy." (Remember, you heard it here first!)

Anyway, here's my in-progress Caspian. I've spent a LOT of time on this one. I'm building this in Dave Sample's on-line class. It is incredibly enjoyable . . . and frustrating . . . and rewarding, etc! Talk about getting your money's worth - you not only get an education from someone who's built custom Caspians for decades, you even end up with a top-notch pistol.

Anyway, enjoy . . .

[RIKA]

Its looking good. Please keep the photos coming.

RIKA

[BigJon]

Beavertail fitted - final contouring to come later.

Now, time for the receiver guts!

[krept]

Wow that's awesome. I wanted to take that class but the tuition and equipment made it way out of my ballpark. Can you give more details what the lessons are like? Apparently they're working...

And just if my eyes aren't going nuts... that's an integral plunger tube?

[BigJon]

No, sir, the plunger tube isn't integral - which is a darned good thing because I've marred it with my fumbling efforts. It is not functionally impaired, but it is aesthetically so. So, may have to change it out when finishing time comes. Dunno.

The lessons are good, but boy is it a lot of work. I like that, though, because the first time out, I need to go slowly. You really, really have to pay attention to every detail of every lesson. Each step builds on the others in multiple ways. The really cool thing, though, is that I'm convinced that what is advertised is true - when you get through with the course, you know that you can build a 1911 that is every bit as reliable as anything anyone can make. You also understand that it can be done without a mill or lathe - that those are only truly required for window dressing and not for functionality.

The way I look at it, it's like I'm buying a custom 1911 for what it's worth, and in the same transaction, I'm getting an education in how to build them for free! I can't see how the instructors do it - they probably only make $100-$200 over the cost of the parts, and that, I know, goes a lot to adminstrative stuff such as computers mailing and shipping costs, etc. I guess they just do it to prove they can, or more likely just because they love and enjoy it.

Best,
Jon

[BigJon]

krept and others -ave Sample, the originator and instructor of the Patriot Course, joined Armslocker today as "Captain Eagle" to, as he told me, "keep [me] honest!" lol! Hope you all will wish him good greetings - especially since today is his 75th birthday. Also, I know he wouldn't mind if you dropped by his site - http://p197.ezboard.com/bdavesplace

Best,
on

[neolithic hunter]

well bigjon i really like those caspian frames, there nice to work with. over the years of building and of thowing together 1911's, the one thing i have found out about building them is, the main differance in a low cost home build and a high dollar custom one is the final finish. i have seen some home builds that if the builder could bead blast and blue, it would look like a really high dollar custom gun. in fact i have seriously considered getting a glass beading or sand blasting cabnet to use on some of my builds. you can hide a lot of little mistakes with the final finish. ya you can do wonders with a dremil, files, and stones when it comes to putting a 1911 together. looks like a good job so far. have fun and LOL on it. :cool:

[BigJon]

Yep, I'm having a ball, neo. This is therapy to me!

[BigEd63]

It's looking nice Jon really good work. :cool:

[krept]

Wow... didn't know that a mill or lathe aren't needed. I've never been much for having a fancy finish. Will definitely be interested to see how this progresses!

cheers

[BigJon]

You hit on a key point - you know, you see all these photos of these really cool-looking guns on the net that are created by custom smiths. Granted, many have forgotten more about their trade than I'll ever know - but given that, a LOT of what they know is how to make a gun "look cool" with fancy machine work. That's one of the real, real eye-openers about Dave's course - it takes work - a LOT of long, tedious, careful work with a calm, steady hand and eye, but I truly, firmly believe that there is nothing - nothing that can be done in the areas of reliability OR accuracy with a mill that can't be done as well - and believe it or not, in some cases even better - with hand tools.

I swear, this is the most enjoyable - and the most educational - thing I've gone through, at least in my adult memory.

Best,
Jon

[krept]

Could you please go over a quick list of what tools you've been using? I'm interested in this stuff... honestly, probably something I won't do for years, but if I'm going to move to 1911s, I'm going to become a student of the design. The major items I know I'm lacking are quality measurement instruments - calipers, depth gauges, etc.

Actually building one up from parts like this would be awesome. When I got into knives instead of collecting them, I learned how to make them. I suspect the 1911 bug will go the same way. Talk about pride of ownership...

cheers

[BigJon]

I'd like too, bro, but I'm afraid I can't get into hand-tool specifics. Part of the class material Dave provides each student is his own personal tool list. At the start of the class, each student entered into a gentleman's agreement with Dave not to disseminate the list, and I'm honor-bound by that agreement. Hope you understand.

Best,
Jon

[RIKA]

Krept, a good start would be Jerry Kuhnhausen's 1911 books vol 1 & 2. They go into theory, operation, building and repairs. I haven't built a 1911 but have fitted and modified several. Have even hand fitted a BarSto barrel to a Browning HiPower. Not putting down Jon's 1911 build in any way because I believe he is building in a controlled and professional manner with tutoring from an experienced master. IME, however, most 1911 mods and improvements are doable if you select quality parts and use good careful hand fitting technique like stoning and avoid the Dremel.

Again my opinion since you probably won't be taking Dave's course. I would get a good solid plain jane 1911, shoot the poo out of it and then decide on what improvements I wanted to make. Maybe add an extended thumb safety, a beavertail grip safety or improve the sights. Careful filing will make a bevelled mag well opening if you like. If you decide you need a new barrel, look at Kart's E-Z Fit barrel. Its not hard to fit and not too costly.

You won't be getting the great experience that Jon is getting but your mods won't be that costly either. Either way the pistol you personally work on will be your unique pistol and it will probably shoot better than you can. Another upside is that when you finally decide to take the course you will already have many of the tools you need.

Luck

RIKA

[BigEd63]

..........and avoid the Dremel.


RIKA


I'd almost want to bet H.C.I. owns stock in that company. :laugh01:

[BigJon]

Okay, folks, she's done. Ready to test fire and send off for final inspection and finishing. Here are new photos.

Best,
Jon

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n169/BigJon3333/Patriot%2082/Completed/IMG_3826.jpg

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n169/BigJon3333/Patriot%2082/Completed/IMG_3827.jpg

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n169/BigJon3333/Patriot%2082/Completed/IMG_3828.jpg

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n169/BigJon3333/Patriot%2082/Completed/IMG_3830.jpg

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n169/BigJon3333/Patriot%2082/Completed/IMG_3825.jpg

[BigEd63]

Sweet looking pistol!

[BigJon]

Thanks. Hope it's also a sweet-SHOOTIN' pistol! We shall see! lol!

Best,
Jon

[RIKA]

Good - (no) great job. I'm envious. :)

RIKA

[Captain Eagle]

Jon has been a great student. We have had some really nice 1911's built Online at home. So far, we have had about an 80% completion rate which is not good enough for me, but good enough for Jazz.

I have had at least three students who have built better guns than I can. Their attention to detail and the clean up work they have done are amazing. Bill Z. was in the first class and his Patriot 11 went to the Shot Show and represented us for the first Online 1911 PATRIOT Class of 2002. You did not hear much about it because there was nothing wrong with it. Another 1911 from that class was put in a Ransome Rest and the group was less than 2 1/2 inches at 50 yards. Not too bad for a first time builder!
We use the best components we can buy and I assemble the gun kits for the students. They are not given many options because the parts from those full page color adds in the gunrags are not often good enough for a PATRIOT. They can build the second gun from whatever they want, but I need the best parts available so that we can builf a beautiful gun with Online Instruction.
The trouble with most people that try to build a quality Caspian is that they have no road map to show them the proper order to do the work. The order that we build these is very important and that is why they do well with this type of education. Tool selection is important, too.
We do have a gentleman's agreement with our builders not to give away what I sell. They buy 20 + years of the knowlege I have aquired building Custom Caspians. I know how to build them and I know how to make them run. Our 1911's run 100 % from the first round out of the muzzle. Not to shabby for first time builders!

[loki]

Where might I find information on this class, looks like something I'd like to do.

Molon Labe

Kim

[BigJon]

Hi, loki. Just go to www.1911patriotcop.us. Also, you can probably just PM the instructor, who posts here occasionally as Captain Eagle (his post appears just above yours in this thread).

Best,
Jon

[BigJon]

Well, I went through the pistol once more before sending to Dave, and while smoothing the beavertail just once more, I rendered it inoperable! Crud! Installed another - PROPERLY this time - and test fired today. First three rounds only made it about 1/2 way from the mag into the pipe, as a result I believe of lack of lubrication. After that, 10 mags went through without a hitch, including the first mag. So, it's done. Sent it off to Dave for grading and finishing. I'll miss it until it comes back - we have spent a LOT of time together over the past few months!

Best,
Jon

[roys29]

Another completed Patriot! I did the logo on a CNC mill and knocked the instructor's socks off! I was in the 2005 class; one of the best classes I've ever taken....period!

http://home.att.net/~roys29/P55_Done1.JPG

[Captain Eagle]

We liberated that font like right now and that is what we use for the website, too. Roy was happy to let us have it. He built a fine gun that went to the Shot Show and was admired by hundreds of gun people. He represented the Class of 2005 and did a fine job of it! Thanks again, Roy! I have some great pics of that gun in my hard drive!

[BigJon]

Hey, I recognize that pistol! I've seen it on the web before and liked it so much I even saved a few photos of it! Isn't that Patriot 55?

[roys29]

Hey Jon,
Yup, 'tis P55 in all her glory! Got some photos of some of my other builds.

Castle Defender I built and hand-checkered the front strap with Dave's help. Bead blasted and parkerized it in my garage.

http://home.att.net/~roys29/Trigger_10_upload.JPG

And my Gladiator 9mm wide body I use for 3-gun competition. First time I shot it in a match I had no misses, a clean match! Bead blasted and parkerized in my garage also. Milled front cocking grooves and sight dovetails with my bench-top mill (NOT the CNC mill).

http://home.att.net/~roys29/Gladiator_Done.JPG

I have a hobby CNC mill at home that I like to engrave personalized logos on the slide, like I did with P55. Also, the "Defender" and "Gladiator" both have custom-built/custom-fit trigger shoes that I also made on my CNC mill so there's no wobble. Posts for both of these builds are on Daves Place under Pistolsmithing.

[Captain Eagle]

See what I start with these guys? The Art of the 1911! Boy! I love those fonts that Roy does! Also the guns are not bad either!

Woof woof woof...............