[andy]

barrel. Hell, Mag Safe's 357 Sig was (still is?) 64 grs at 2200 fps in 5" barrels. Flat trajectory is not any real help at hitting at "long range" with the pistol, because under lethal stress, the group size is 10" at 25 yds, anyway.

 

[Rich Z]

But I thought the argument was about velocity being the key ingredient?

 

[andy]

yeah, but you dont have to bother

with the Boz in order to get even higher velocity. Back iin 1980, THV Arcane had a 45 gr, 9x19 5" barrel, at 2400 fps (claimed) It was solid brass, machined on a lathe, the bullet that is. It had a huge hollowbase, making room for more powder, and very little bore-contact surface. Straight walled cases are more efficient than bottlenecks, at least, in service pistol barrel lengths. If I wanted max velocity, I'd look at a shortened 9mm Win mag case, with very short bullets, actually. Me, I favor the .45 diameter, unless wanting a pocket gun forces ya to go with the 9mm case. I still want highest velocity, understand, but also favor having large chunks when the bullet breaks up into 3 segments. I do not favor 3" of penetration, with watered down Glasers, but I"d sure prefer .45 Super Mag Safe's to .230gr .45 jhp's, at 900 fps. 100 grs, 1800 fps, 4" barrel, aint bad. Aint great either, tho, cause only get 16 pellets, 4 of them #4, 12 of them #2 birdshot.

 

[I_Have_a_Boz]

224 Boz is a joke, 55 grs, 2200 fps, 6" barrel

It's not a joke if you are on the other end of it.

Using the 55gr the velocity is closer to 2750 - 2800 FPS and is devistating on kevlar and other types of soft armour.

Using the 62gr ss109's it will punch holes in 2 (two) 1/2" thick hardened steel plates side by side. They will go through just about any material at any hardness. The only thing that I have shot that was not penetrated was a 6" thick (yes I said thick as in 6" wide) piece of solid aluminum, it broke it into pieces, and a 6" thick piece of stainless steel, left a deep crater in the material.

The metal trauma plates that are outdate and no longer used in bullet proof vest, well the 62gr goes through 6-8 of them. Several test were performed, well lets just say that a .224 boz is no joke.

 

[Rich Z]

I assume you are outside of the USA then, or in law enforcement. I didn't think we could get that gun and ammunition here in the states.

I'd be curious to know who such velocities can be attained out of a short handgun barrel, though. That's pretty much what you get out of a .223 in a 16 inch barrel, if I remember correctly.

 

[I_Have_a_Boz]

I've never seen the law reguarding the .224 BOZ, civil-defense makes a big deal about it, but as far as I am concerned, wildcats are not illegal.

If the .224 boz was illegal, then so would any ar15 pistol shooting ss109, the .223 timbs and thousands of other wildcats with high velocity rounds would also be illegal, but they are not.

If anyone has the law concerning wildcats such as these, i'd love to see them.

If you are wanting a .224 boz, I have for sale the following :

1 - Barrel Finish Reamer NEW Never used.

1 Set of American Made (5 dies) case forming and reloading dies NEW Never used.

1 - Laminated Blueprint of .224 BOZ round.

(I can also sell you a Glock 20 extended Barrel rifled for .224, however you would need to have it Professionally reamed with the Barrel Finish Reamer)

You would be able to chamber a pistol or rifle barrel to suit your needs, and reload your own ammo.

Serious Inquiries Only. (the items are not cheap)
Subject : .224 boz
[email protected]

 

[Rich Z]

Last I heard was that this round and the guns that fire it were not allowed to be imported into the USA. I believe there is a patent infringement problem with anyone stateside making one themselves for sale here.

I don't know the truth of the matter, but if I am wrong and it IS available here, I would want to know about it.

 

[AZ COLLECTOR]

would you be so kind as to post a few pics of the reamer and a finished case next to the dies. i am interested.
sean

 

[ABCF]

Last I heard was that this round and the guns that fire it were not allowed to be imported into the USA.

This is incorrect. The Brit behind the design refuses to deal with non-LEO/non-Mil and refuses to offer his product on the commercial market. It is completely voluntary and has doomed his creation to a marginal existance.

 

[Chippathingy]

Using the 55gr the velocity is closer to 2750 - 2800 FPS

Using the 62gr ss109's it will punch holes in 2 (two) 1/2" thick hardened steel plates side by side. They will go through just about any material at any hardness. The only thing that I have shot that was not penetrated was a 6" thick (yes I said thick as in 6" wide) piece of solid aluminum, it broke it into pieces, and a 6" thick piece of stainless steel, left a deep crater in the material.

The metal trauma plates that are outdate and no longer used in bullet proof vest, well the 62gr goes through 6-8 of them. Several test were performed, well lets just say that a .224 boz is no joke.

BS
------------------------------------

 

[Rich Z]

This is incorrect. The Brit behind the design refuses to deal with non-LEO/non-Mil and refuses to offer his product on the commercial market. It is completely voluntary and has doomed his creation to a marginal existance.

I read the patent he claims on the Boz as well. Pure horse manure if you ask me. I wish someone over here would develop it and just thumb their nose at the guy. Maybe with all of the popularity being evident with the 5.7x28 round perhaps someone over here will get the bright idea that people would actually BUY something like that in a heart beat.

 

[DaRkWoLf]

Why not just base it off of a .45 ACP?

We'd have the advantage of more case capacity, more velocity, and extreme ease of conversion.

It truly would suit america: Bigger, easier, stronger.

Damn I bet that just pissed off our canadian population :duck:

 

[hipster]

It truly would suit america: Bigger, easier, stronger. Damn I bet that just pissed off our canadian population

So Wolf does that mean to suit us it would have to be Smaller,harder and weaker???? Let me tell you somthing dude...........


Ha Ha had you going I bet, pretty hard to piss off any sensible Canadian. If you feel guilty the least you could do is buy all the canucks here a beer when you turn legal age. :bird:

 

[DaRkWoLf]

If you feel guilty the least you could do is buy all the canucks here a beer when you turn legal age. :bird:

Sure thing. Remind me in 6 years. :dgrin:

I wonder if Canadian beer is better than American crud.

 

[Garand]

The only real beer produced in North America is Canadian, the rest is flavoured water!!

 

[GBullet]

Using the 55gr the velocity is closer to 2750 - 2800 FPS and is devistating on kevlar and other types of soft armour.

Using the 62gr ss109's it will punch holes in 2 (two) 1/2" thick hardened steel plates side by side. They will go through just about any material at any hardness. The only thing that I have shot that was not penetrated was a 6" thick (yes I said thick as in 6" wide) piece of solid aluminum, it broke it into pieces, and a 6" thick piece of stainless steel, left a deep crater in the material.

The metal trauma plates that are outdate and no longer used in bullet proof vest, well the 62gr goes through 6-8 of them. Several test were performed, well lets just say that a .224 boz is no joke.

Penetration of hard targets is largely a function of energy density and bullet construction. Since the Boz and the SS109 can use the same bullet, the frontal area and bullet construction are identical. The difference in how the two rounds penetrate then becomes only a function of kinetic energy.

Using your numbers, the Boz has 3/4 of the energy of the SS109. Hence, the Boz cannot penetrate as much as a SS109.

Some American self-propelled howitzers have used 6" aluminum plate as small arms protection. IIRC, in many places the armor of the M60 and other similar tanks is 4" cast steel. If you were correct about the penetration of the .224 Boz, soldiers could simply use 1911's converted to .224 Boz to stop enemy tanks. This seems unlikely.

 

[GBullet]

For what it's worth, I think that andy is right that the velocity of a 55 gn bullet from the .224 Boz 1911 is 2200 fps, not 2800 fps.

 

[AZ COLLECTOR]

i still havent got the info i requested.....
i smell BS in a big way.
but whats new....and i also think andy was correct.
sean

 

[DaRkWoLf]

i still havent got the info i requested.....
i smell BS in a big way.
but whats new....and i also think andy was correct.
sean

I believe JD was right when he said the Boz was 2200 as well. A .40 necked down just dosent seem like it would give that kind of performance.

2500 would probably the .45 ACP case necked down if someone took my joke literally.

 

[GBullet]

DaRkWoLf, it was done about 1978 or 1979. A gunwriter necked down a .45 to .22 and chambered a 1911 to fire it. I think he called it a ".22 Super" or something similar.