[Terry G]

I am going to adress this once more. As I said in my earlier post's, I would probably not be able to replicate my shooting again in my lifetime. Was it a fluke? Sure it was. I did not have a reaction time. I was the one that yelled, GO! It was on my own range with absolutely no pressure. The World class shooter's can do this pretty much on demand, under pressure. But, I will say this, the service pistols, the Glock's, Colt's, SIG'S and Beretta's, etc., can should better than people can. Anyone whos shoots and trains on a regualr basis, but at least one thousand rounds a month, must have a day where they absolutely amazed their fellow shooters , and themselves. For hunters, haven't you taken that two hundred yard shot at a running deer and were amazed when it folded up? Or the two ducks crossing at 60 MPH and they both folded? Or three grouse that went up in front of your trusty dog, and you nailed all three? I've done all three. ONCE! I have also had day's when I couldn't hit a bull in the A** with a handful of sand. That's why Leatham is making the big bucks and I dealt with convicts. That's it. I'll say no more.

 

[brass hammer]

you know! TERRY G

i made [1] fluke shot once, back in the mid-west, a fall afternoon and was cutting across a dry pond[the brothers[farmers] built it, but it never did hold water, anyway ,stompin' across it through the broken cattails a covey of bobwhites broke and [1] flew straight away toward the levee, i had my marlin#39 .22 with peep sight and thought 'if evers the time ,it's now' and shouldered the .22 and cracked one off at the quail flying straight away, and as i did another bird was travelling from right to left in front of him and drilled them both 'on the wing' with [1],22 h.p. i saw them go down and recovered both birds ,ha!i knew it was an oddball shot, the [1] straight away i figured to hit, or thought i could, but the[#2]bird was his bad luck, although, i have my doubts of people believing this 'huntin' tale it is true nevertheless.


as i rec'ollect the range was about 15-20yards as the bad luck crosser crashed in the briar vines[i remember pulling it out of that stuff]

 

[RIKA]

Its not a big deal. Everybody has a stroke of luck, even me. Last year at deer camp, Jack and I were taking a stroll when we came across a cottonmouth on the narrow path. Reflexively I drew the Ruger Blackhawk and fired from the hip. The 250gr flat point bullet removed the snake's head. I had to suffer being called John Wayne for the rest of the trip. It was a fluke that I only mention here among friends.

RIKA

 

[Rich Z]

I remember once this old timer was showing off his 22-250 bolt action and was firing down at a target down around 150 yards away or so. I was really only into semi autos, but the guy wanted me to shoot his gun. Well OK, I wasn't into it, but maybe it would shut him up. So I half heartedly sighted the target and squeezed the trigger. I only wanted one shot, so we all walked down to the target to take a look at it.

I saw a hole somewhere around the 7 ring right at the top, so I just breezily said it looked like the gun was shooting a little high. Everyone just busted out laughing and I didn't have a clue what that was all about. Well, the hole I saw wasn't the one I made. MY hole cut the top posts of the X ring. And yes, it WAS just a little high..... I didn't say another word......

 

[Magnum88C]

I guess my best fluke was shooting a 2" by 1.5" single hole with 15 rounds from my SP-101 snubbie. I know that's terrific shooting for a snubbie at that range, and the more incredible because that was the group after 2 reloads. I remember looking at the gun and asking it where my real gun was and who the Hell are you?

It's not a handgun story, but I do remember a guy shooting a .75" group at 100 yards with MY SKS. Boy was I pissed. . .:dgrin:

 

[andy]

u r a LIAR. World Class shooters can't even come CLOSE

to doing what you claim, and they've SAID so, both here and at The High Road.

 

[Hard Rock]

to doing what you claim, and they've SAID so, both here and at The High Road.

Then they obviously aren't as "world class" as they think they are.

I hate to tell you this Gunkid but there are guys out there that don't shoot in competition that make guys like Rob Leatham look like amateurs.

Mike

 

[Ankeny]

that's why you have no credibility

there are guys out there that don't shoot in competition that make guys like Rob Leatham look like amateurs

That has to be the single most ignorant thing I have ever read anywhere, including the Internet. It's comments like that rob you weekend can plinkers of all credibility. In my experience, wannabe gunslingers hiding behind Internet anonymity are totally clueless.

When you guys start going to extremes like applying superhuman characteristics to world class shooters such as

The World class shooter's can do this pretty much on demand, under pressure.

then bash Rob Leatham in the next breath, you are not doing yourselves any favors.

I have personally shot with world class shooters from several disciplines. So I'll pose this question to all of you, how many "world class" competitors have you shared the range with? How many of you can do a Bill Drill in 1.5 seconds? How many of you can draw from surrender, fire a round COM on an IPSC target, reload, fire the second round, and catch the first magazine before it hits the ground...all of this in under two seconds? How many of you have even seen stuff like that done? Get a grip.

I'll leave you with my perception of your little home on the Web. You folks are cluless about the skill set required to be "world class" in any endeavor. This Web site is full of BS being spread from evey angle. My sense is most of you have lost all rationale thought in your zeal to rattle sabers with Andy.

As a serious student of pistolcraft I offer this advice. Get yourselves back to a sense of normality and speak of what you "know" and can "do". The place to start would be by getting rid of Andy. The guy is obviously a troll of the highest order.

In the mean time, just shut up and shoot.

 

[RIKA]

Pretty angry there Akeny. Sounds like something threatened your little world. Instead of lashing out at Hard Rock, why not ask him about his qualifications and what motivated his statement.

RIKA

 

[krept]

My final comments on this issue (hopefully).

Ankeny proved that he can shoot basically as fast as Terry (whom I did NOT ID) claimed.

The differences:

- Ankeny was shooting a highly tuned Les Baer built specifically for gaming and Terry was using a stock G21.

- Ankeny was shooting cartridges HAND TAILORED for speed shooting (IIRC 200gr SWCs with a minimum power factor?) and Terry was shooting full power STOCK 230gr FMJ.

- Ankeny did his shooting in roughly 2.4 seconds in the A zone, Terry did his shooting in roughly the same amount of time (2.71 seconds) in a 3" group. I don't know how that equates to the A zone but it is probably close.

Anything else? Oh yeah, Ankeny shot at 5 yards and Terry shot at 25.

Ankeny posted a video. Terry posted a target.

Here are some quotes from Terry:

That's when the timer stopped after I had fired ten rounds. I know that's not World Class fast, but it will keep me alive.

Ankeny has been around world class shooters, so he should be a pretty good judge here... AND probably an objective one because he has no beef with Terry NOR a reason to support andy. If he says guys like Leatham, who he has seen shoot, doesn't shoot that well, then, well... umhmm.

I probably could have done better with a Phoenix Arms HP 22.

I'm kind of surprised, this is no world shaking feat. A skinny little Federal Correctional Officer with a Beretta 92 FS kicked my posterior on the Armed Escort Course.

(meaning he shoots better, or at least at this level more consistantly?)

So anyways... funny story. I was drinking last night and watching the Red Sox embarrass the Yankees at home. If anyone was watching, did you see the play where Alex Rodriguez was running to first and he OBVIOUSLY, INTENTIONALLY knocked the ball out of the Boston guy's hand (clear interference, breaking the rules)? He didn't even touch the base, yet the first base ump called him SAFE.

No, so here's the good part. They PLAY the replay on the screen for everyone to SEE plain as day and all the fans start BOOOING because they made him go back because he CHEATED. JETER was in the fkn dugout shaking his head in disbelief at the call making motions with his hand that A-Rod was SAFE. LOFL.

My point here? When you're on the same team as someone or rooting for someone, sometimes you just don't see things objectively. Andy called BS on the target when he first saw it, right away. I was dumbfounded by the shooting, so asked on another forum.

The final thing I want to say, is you can do a search for my username on the following forums:

thehighroad.org
thefiringline.com
bladeforums.com
knifenetwork.com
mma.tv
glocktalk.com
hkpro.com and probably more. I've been posting online under this nick and this nick ALONE for over 4 years. I've never once, EVER, had a bone to pick with anyone and I've never called anyone out. I'm STILL not calling Terry a liar here but the evidence is pretty clear that things are a little off kilter. Now, if you privately admit this but publicly say different or remain silent, that is one thing.

If you wholeheartedly believe this, on the other hand, I believe that there are three people (NOT andy, gunkid, JD, Melvin, whatever) that are willing to bet a thousand dollars that this can't be replicated (probably even close) ONE time in one hundred. If you DO believe this, maybe you can pony up the money for Terry to put up against these guys. Heck, they might even be willing to take the bet that the guy with the Beretta can't shoot 3" group in 3 seconds @ 25 yards!

The last thing I want to do (and this can be seen in my entire history of posting online) is to embarass someone by calling BS. But if I see something like the Yankees fans and Jeter did last night, it makes it really hard for me to STFU.

Hopefully you folks will know I have ZERO bones to pick with anyone on here. If you recognize this, perhaps it will lend at least a LITTLE objectivity to my observations.

 

[krept]

Hard Rock, who would you consider an objective source, a GOOD shooter that I can ask about this kind of shooting?

Obviously, if Terry is claiming that this was a one-time "fluke" (as opposed to him just being "hot" that given day) it's a moot point.

If it's a fluke, however, it's kind of like me telling you "it's impossible for you to win the lottery" and a couple days (or maybe hours?) later you come back with a winning ticket.

like my bro in law says "anything's possible!"

i just can't argue with that, but on most cases, Occam's razor works pretty well. Only Terry knows for sure.

cheers

 

[Ankeny]

Holy crap Krept. Hey that would make a nice poem.

Raider:

No one has threatned my little world, I am just calling it like I see it. I am not a world class shooter, never claimed to be one. However, I do know what it takes to shoot fast and accurately. On occasion I have shot Grand Master scores. I am proud to say I have been whooped by some pretty salty pistoleros.

What I am saying is the members of this forum spead bull$hit like yuppies spread cream cheese on a bagel. Take the old argument that there are people lurking around who can make Robbie look like an amatuer. How ignorant do you guys think I am? TGO is obviously the best IPSC shooter in history. Yeah, there might be ISU, PPC and BE shooters that can make Leatham struggle in their world, but not a person alive can make Robbie look pathetic at what Robbie does. His record speaks for itself.

 

[Wylycoyte]

The true question remains...

Is it an onion bagel, or just plain?

 

[Hard Ball]

IPSC is not reality. Paper targets don't shoot back!

The best American pistol shooters are in Delta Force.

 

[Wylycoyte]

The best American pistol shooters are in Delta Force.

Actually, I somewhat doubt that. If you want to qualify that and say that the best combat pistol shooters are in Delta, I'd be more inclined to acknowledge that that might well be so.

I base this on the guys I've been told about who show up at Bill Rogers' course in Ellijay. Lots of guys who are in high-risk professions do not do as well as IPSC guys simply because they have a number of skills that they need to train to a high level, and can't afford to spend all their time slinging lead downrange and blathering about "fast splits".

 

[Ankeny]

IPSC is a game. The game is about shooting fast and accurately on the dreaded square range. Don't confuse tactics, strategy and gunhandling skills.

FWIW, there are several Grand Master and world class IPSC shooters who are in the military and/or law enforcement. Many of these guys have shot for blood. Don't discredit their pistolcraft simply because you have a hard on for gamers.

When elite military units and special law enforcement agencies look for the very best trainers in the world to teach pure gunhandling skills, where do they go? Last time I checked they secured the services of guys like Jerry Barnhart (The Burner and World Class IPSC shooter), The Tactical Shooting Academy (Ron Avery, USPSA L10 National Champion), and when the spooks and operators reach out for the very best who do they call? Ghost Busters? Nope, they drop a dime on TGO (The Great One, Rob Leatham). Yeah, the operators are smart enough to know the gamers rock when it comes to pure gunhandling skills. For tactics and mindset they bring in the warriors.

BTW, folks acknowledge Bill Rogers as one of the finest defensive handgun trainers in the world. What is his background? He was another one of those darned gamers.

 

[RIKA]

Akeny, can you give us an idea what Barnhart and Leatham teach these elite agents? Kind of a course outline. I am guessing that it has nothing to do with gun handling, per se, or tactics.

This is not a trick question as I am really interested.

RIKA

 

[brass hammer]

i can change a blown-out mobile home tire 10 times faster[any weather/terrain] than anybody on the internet, why you ask??????


practice.....practice.....practice....


but the true question remains... is it an onion bagel?




and great fun was had by one and all :dgrin:

 

[RIKA]

Brass, please quit talking about food. I'm on a diet and starving.

Luv ya anyway.

RIKA

 

[brass hammer]

copy ,li' sis' i'm out!

i did see t.h.r. video of the 'gentlemans' ....pretty damn slick/impressive

*[i didn't pay attention on how to spell his handle/name]