Arms Locker banner

1 - 20 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
HE, if get inside 1/2 a mile of one that's 1/2 mile long, unless boat turns NINETY degrees. :) have it be towing a ski-doo, wearing your scuba. Get that close, detonator on nose of boat, cut loose the ski-doo, dive overboard. What they gonna do about it, hmm? Have a cutter on each side of each tanker, the last 50 miles? :) ANY impact means that the tanker either explodes or is set-afire. what you think THAT will mean to the price of gas and diesel, hmm? Stay below water until impact tells you if at risk on the surface, then take off. Not that hard to blow the pipelines between off-loading point and shore, either.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,648 Posts
No, actually all they need is one hawkeye in the air, and they can track all the boats for a very long distance.

Then they can send a helo to investigate / take action if necessary.

You are very behind on technology.

BTW, being under water that close to that big an explosion - you will be your first casulty.

There are other flaws in your scenario, but it is fun reading...

:devil:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,279 Posts
Boy, think of all that burning gas on top of the water. Fried ski-doo and charbroiled gunkid. Ugh!

RIKA
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,382 Posts
Yes tard, you can miss a 1/2 mile long supertanker from half a mile away...

You really want to be submerged when such an explosion occurs on the waterline that close? Talk about ignorant...

Mike
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,648 Posts
I guess he is immune to shock waves and the non-compressability of water doesn't aply to him either.

I wonder what it's like to be able to completely ignore the laws of physics and reality like that...

:devil:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,582 Posts
Well they say gawd protects fools and idiots! The dipstick is living proof of it!!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
720 Posts
Anyone concussed by an underwater explosion (happened to me and swim buddy off Naples It. in 1977) would be sure to include that possiblility in any survivable E&E plan!
SatCong (one bell-rung squid)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,693 Posts
andy said:
can't MISS supertanker with ski boat full of HE, if get inside 1/2 a mile of one that's 1/2 mile long, unless boat turns NINETY degrees...
Actually, at a half mile distance, to a half-mile-wide target (assuming you're lined up on the center of the target), a change of 22.6 degrees would miss. Graph it out...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,950 Posts
I don't have a graph but I've got a ghetto Paint application :D

To me it looks like it would require a total deviation of 45.1 degrees in opposing directions for it to miss. Even if the boat (in blue) rotates 40 degrees clockwise and the ski (red) continued dead straight it would still impact.

The key is to disable the dead man switch on the ski so it doesn't go into circles/kill the engine (a safety for when you fall off) AND make sure that the current/wind/chop etc don't affect the ski (the hardest part). Wouldn't it be easier to do it like the SEALz? ;)

cheers
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,693 Posts
Only flaw with your graph is that your "X" axis (horizontal red) line should intersect with the CENTER of the "Y" axis (vertical blue) line, not the bottom of it.

The way it's drawn, you're aiming at the tip of one end of the boat (say, the rudder), not the middle of your target, and that means that while it's true that a 44.9 degree drift to the left (up) would still impact the target, a RIGHT (or down) drift of only 0.1 degree would miss completely.

Aiming at the center, your side-to-side variances (allowances for error) are equal; and each "side" of the target equals one-half of the distance TO the target. Aiming at the center of a target a half-mile in width, gives a quarter mile leeway on each side, or a radian of 22.5 degrees in either direction. Less than 22.5 and you hit the target; more than 22.5 and you miss.

That means one-fourth the room for error, compared to 90 degrees; but still do-able I would imagine. (Except for the "underwater during the blast" thing. None for me, thanks. A half-stick of dynamite gets us ******** a bunch of fish that way. Can't imagine a "boat load of HE"...)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,890 Posts
Actually, the angle for a miss would be greater on one side than the other, depending on how fast the tanker was moving. . .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,950 Posts
John, I think I see what you're saying and maybe the problem w/ the drawing is that I rushed it on a crap problem and didn't have a grid to go off of so it was all freehand. I also thought the attack would occur with the tanker stationary, if it were moving = much tougher - way more currents and open sea chop, etc.

The middle of the three red lines (the one that continues to the corner) is the projected path of the jetski. The two lines at 12:00 and 3:00 to it represent the allowable deviation of 45 degrees (assuming stationary target). The blue diagonal line (running SSE to NNW) represents the ship... the blue dashed line shows it's max deviation of 45 degrees CW to get nailed. You could do the same CCW but it would be even more messy.

In any event... if you guys remember what happened a little while back when one damn gasonline pipline burst between Phoenix and Tucson... THAT'S what I'm worried about, not so much another Exxon Valdez... although the ecological impact would be far greater.

cheers
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
IN the water is one thing for the blast, ABOVE the water is another. I doubt the boat would immediately detonate, unless empty of oil, full of fumes. Explosions always take the path of least resistance. Just having somebody TRY would up the cost of oil by 50% :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,382 Posts
You don't know anything about seaborne demolitions do you? You also don't know how energy travels either. Tell you what, stick your head under the water at a pond, have a friend fire a bullet out of a submerged 9mm pistol at the other end of the pond say about 30-50 yards away.

I bet you won't hear anything except a ringing noise for about a week. Oh yeah, you can wear hearing protection if you want too.... it won't help.

Now, after you do that, think about how bad an explosion half a mile away is going to feel... You think the shock you'll feel in your head with a pistol round is bad, just wait til you feel the pain and anguish of a serious waterbourne detonation.

Mike

Mike
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
285 Posts
Explosions always take the path of least resistance.
Nope, you've never used explosives have you?

When I blow through steel the tamper I use isn't tougher then the steel. How come I can blow through the steel if you're right and explosions always take the path of least resistance?

Explain that one bub.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,648 Posts
Soundwaves and shockwaves travel more efficiently through denser material. Water is more dense than air.

You really don't think your fantasies through very well, and you certainly don't have a lot of experience with stuff in the real world.

you might try getting out more often.

:devil:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,118 Posts
It probably would not be easier to do it as would the Navy Seals. They get lots of training to do what they do and that is hard work.

While I am not condoning such acts in any way shape or form, I will discuss the matter hypothetically: In a hypothetical situation, anyone with half a brain can fill up a power boat with explosives and a pretty foolproof detonator, find a moron to drive it, then have the moron aim that boat at a ship that is at anchor in harbor or at sea and hopefully make it go kaboom. Whether or not the moron survives would likely be inconsequential to the guy with the half brain. Of course there are factors as mentioned like currents, waves and the wind and getting the power boat to go straight at the target. This can all be helped out by waiting for a nice calm day and doing it while the tanker is in the harbor.

As to the survivability (is that a word) factor, if you jump into the drink and have another boat waiting with a ski tow line, all you do is grab hold and the guy driving that boat takes off toward a further distance from the impact. Or then again you could have the boat started up from the shoreline, get it going at the ship and be within close enough distance of the shore for you to get out of the drink before the impact. No one ever said, not even the laws of physics, that the explosive laden power boat has to be moving fast to hit that ship and detonate. A tanker at anchor will never get out of the way by getting under weigh in time!

If you were really concerned about steering that power boat, then I imagine a remote control could be set up that would get the boat to the ship even at high speed. A visit to a place like radio Shack or a hobby shop would probably give some info on that one.

Of course by trying this you may wind up wasting a boat load of explosives because you may miss. There is always the Murphy factor! As Murphy would have it, a piece of drift wood, or pleasure craft or whatever would come between the tanker and the explosive laden power boat at the precise moment to scuttle the best of your plans in such regard.

The thing is though that if this is ever tried by bonafide terrorists, especially the Muslim extremists type (or any other extremist types), they will probably have a suicide boat driver at the controls - don't you think? Those tankers would be easy targets even with all the Coast Guard protection in the world, and there are a lot more tankers around our shores than there are Coast Guard boats/ships, or helicopters.

Heavens forbid it comes to this, but maybe it will not. If our oil supply is cut off with a large number (and I do mean large number) of successful attacks like that, here is what would likely happen: There would be a Naval blockade of the Gulf Of Mexico. Mines would be laid around oil platforms in the gulf. Oil Platforms would be equipped with personnel and defensive arms to fend off such attacks. The Alaskan wilderness would be open to drilling. Land based oil rigs would be secured, seriously secured. Oil pipelines would be seriously secured. Plenty of people out of work would now find jobs working for security companies who provided security to oil companies.

Here is something else that would also happen eventually: countries like Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain would change their tunes with regard to fighting terrorism because much of that oil in those exploded tankers came from them. Sure it may already have been paid for, or maybe not. If already paid for, well once the oil started flowing more freely over here, they would feel the pinch. Sure so would we, but we do have oil - enough to survive even if it meant drastically changing how we use it. They have nothing but oil and date palms, and maybe a few goats and camels. Would they be willing to sacrifice the money they make from the largest consumer of oil products in the world, I doubt it. If the oil in those exploded tankers was not already paid for, well that would make them act sooner.

The US would also likely cut off exports to many countries, you know the sanctions thing. Europe is just feeling self satisfied with their so called economic union, they would not have enough to export without hurting them selves - not for any long term of over a year or two. The price they pas for oil would also drop, because now the Arab countries who produce oil would have a glut since the terrorists cut off supplies to the US, and or since the US would likely embargo foreign oil at least from countries who were not fully cooperative with us - really cooperative. Remember this all hinges on many large scale and successful attacks on oil tankers.

The world would be in an upheaval. Many of our so called allies in Europe would turncoat. The French, the Germans, the Spanish. I think maybe we would also get some unexpected allies like the Russians, the Poles, the Greeks. I am fairly confident that the English would see the light. Canada would be at our side as they would be as threatened by this as would we. Mexico likewise. Central and South America are a crap shoot, but we would likely have some countries down there that count allying themselves with us. WWIII would be at hand. George W. may actually wake up one morning and scream out "Bully For America!" and the rest would become history.

Of course there is another thing that would likely happen if our oil supply was seriously cut off; in the long term we would look to alcohol based fuels and new tech to use them. We would also be seeing a lot more electric vehicles. This, of course, all would depend upon the seriousness of the threat to our oil supplies. If it gets that serious, then be ready for WWII type rationing. Get ready for victory gardens -0 hell do most even know what they were. Get ready for scrap metal collection drives. Get ready for Rosie the Rivetter. Get ready for gas masks for every American, fallout shelters, air raid warnings and air raid drills and maybe even real air raids. Get ready for a civil defense system being implemented. Get ready for mass enlistment in the military, get ready for a draft, get ready for WWIII, and get ready for a lot of little countries with a few big ones trying to take us over and split the pie. Get ready for hard times including the aftermath of attacks on our own shores. The world had better be ready too because we will not go down without a fight - nor would I think our truest allies. It would be one hell of a fight and I am pretty sure we would taste victory once again but at a great loss, possibly the greatest we have ever sustained. It brings to mind one of the most gloomy songs I have ever heard: Bad Moon Rising by Credence Clearwater Revival, and particularly these words from that song: "I hope you have got your things together, I hope you are quite prepared to die". These are the words we as Americans must be willing to live in order to uphold Freedom and to protect our Liberties; these are the words we must shove down the throats of our enemies.
 
1 - 20 of 39 Posts
Top