[andy]

a book about one man's search for "quality". He ended up doing some time in a nut ward, because he couldn't be bothered to look in a dictionary. Quality is defined as "conformance to standards". So, quality can vary a LOT, depending upon the standards "set" by anyone who is looking for "quality. Dip<font color=red>*</font><font color=red>*</font><font color=red>*</font><font color=red>*</font>s like Hard Rock "want' to put 20,000 rds a year thru a silencer. Anyone with sense regards that as utterly stupid. You can PRACTICE with the unsilenced gun. The silencer is for when it MATTERS if the gun is noisy or not. that AINT often.

 

[andy]

SIMILARLY, guys run down a gun, if its owner is unwilling to put more than a couple of hundred rds a year thru it. Hey, it's HIS gun, what's it to you how much he shoots it? In a given case, a certain guy can outshoot you and your Makarov or .38 snub, with his pocket Star, at the sort of speed shooting that MATTERS, and he can hit 2-3 times as hard as you can with those lw pos, and the Star is a LOT more pocketable. So he "has" to practice with the .22 unit and the 9mm lw Commander, so what? What MATTERS is the end result, capability wise, and he's WAY ahead of you.

 

[Magnum88C]

Yeah, but that still leaves you WAY behind.

 

[Hard Rock]

You are totally wrong. You do know that a suppressed firearm shoots differently than an unsuppressed one right? You know that on a rifle, the POI shifts with a suppressor right? That is one of the reasons I know you are FOS about cans Tard. You claim 400 yard ability with your CAR but you don't know how the suppressor is going to change the POI.

Why do you think I shoot so much? I shoot suppressed and unsuppressed a lot because I not only want to know but need to know the POI shift and how the guns operation is effected by suppressors.

So, Mr. Expert on suppressors, how far off will the POI be on your CAR at 100 yards? And in what way? How about 200 yards? 300? 400? Or since you claim that a .223 can do everything a .308 can do, how about 1000 yards?

You are a fool and a liar of the lowest caliber.

Mike

 

[Aslan]

Once again, you get it wrong. Sure, quality can be a subjective thing like you are trying to make it.

But, quality is usually defined using a strict set of criteria (that's why ISO and six sigma efforts are important.)

People get PHD's in quality control, fault prediction and the like.

You keep throwing out terms with half-assed understanding and out of context.

stick to stuff you know something about.

But, you also take cobbled up POS hack jobs and claim them to be quality.

:devil:

 

[BigEd]

He sure does spend a load of time trying to justify being a cheapskate half-assing never was been.
Build a pistol AR or SBR out of the cheapest junker parts and a shitty 80% lower and see what you get IF you ever shoot it more than 10rds a year, even with the ".22 Unit".
He used to talk about bondo and paracord for grips and handguard.
Now that's quality!🙄
Can I get a Walla Walla!

 

[John in AR]

This:

...to put 20,000 rds a year thru a silencer. Anyone with sense regards that as utterly stupid. You can PRACTICE with the unsilenced gun. The silencer is for when it MATTERS if the gun is noisy or not. that AINT often.

From the same person who said this:

why want a noisy gun, EVER?
...are you really THAT stupid?

And this:

wtf would you WANT a noisy gun?

...Given a compact, lw carbine, there's "room" for the bulk and weight of a small, lw silencer. You dont have to give up anything that matters in order to get it. So why not have it?

You say that to use a silencer on a regular basis is ‘utterly stupid’. You also say that there’s no reason to use a gun on a regular basis WITHOUT a suppressor. Got it.

Thing is, those are both true in your case, aren’t they? I mean since you don’t actually shoot guns on a regular basis anyway; either with or without a suppressor. That’s true, isn’t it?

 

[Dorobuta]

a book about one man's search for "quality". He ended up doing some time in a nut ward, because he couldn't be bothered to look in a dictionary. Quality is defined as "conformance to standards". So, quality can vary a LOT, depending upon the standards "set" by anyone who is looking for "quality. Dip<font color=red></font><font color=red></font><font color=red></font><font color=red></font>s like Hard Rock "want' to put 20,000 rds a year thru a silencer. Anyone with sense regards that as utterly stupid. You can PRACTICE with the unsilenced gun. The silencer is for when it MATTERS if the gun is noisy or not. that AINT often.

You can practice with it un-silenced, and then not know the point of impact when the silencer is mounted, you won't know how the silencer performs in various conditions, etc.

The smart person wants gear that will last many thousands of rounds, or uses. especially if it is gear you life may depend on. only a fool doesn't understand this.

I'd rather have a silencer rated for many thousands of rounds, than one that isn't.

I find it matters more often than not for the gun to be silenced. I also find it maters to know how the point of impact shifts with and without the silencer. I find it matters to see how the silencer holds up under field conditions.

My standards for quality are clearly much higher than yours. If you want to lower your standards for equipment you may be betting your life on, more power to you.

 

[BigEd]

The only thing Melvin seems to be beating us in is a "Race to the bottom." in which quality is concerned.
Can't believe Senor El Jefe the self proclaimed (& deluded) slum Lord of Slum Lord's can't fork over the money for better gear not just Firearms.🙄

 

[Garand]

Admittedly Melvin isn't the Elon Musk of the finacial world, but the concept of getting the "best bang for your buck" seems to elude him. Buying cobbled up crap is only going to ensue one thing, a severe limitation to his chances of survival if his kit is ever required.

 

[Dorobuta]

I get it, we can't afford (well I can't), to spend a million dollars on gear. But, if we seriously believe our lives will depend on it, we should be getting the absolute best gear that we can. That may mean skipping a few frivolous purchases, or watching our budgets, etc. - the point being that if you believe that SHTF is inevitable, you should be going all in on gear. You should be training, practicing, testing, etc.

Personally, I don't think we'll see the end of civilization in our lifetimes, but we will see localized and short term disasters where we will need to be prepared. YMMV

 

[Dorobuta]

a book about one man's search for "quality". He ended up doing some time in a nut ward, because he couldn't be bothered to look in a dictionary. Quality is defined as "conformance to standards". So, quality can vary a LOT, depending upon the standards "set" by anyone who is looking for "quality. Dip<font color=red></font><font color=red></font><font color=red></font><font color=red></font>s like Hard Rock "want' to put 20,000 rds a year thru a silencer. Anyone with sense regards that as utterly stupid. You can PRACTICE with the unsilenced gun. The silencer is for when it MATTERS if the gun is noisy or not. that AINT often.

Actually, there are defined standards for quality and defect rates, etc. You should google stuff like ISO 9000, Six Sigma, etc.

then there are military standards, i.e. Mil-spec - while you poo-poo all things military, these standards do define a level of shelf life and abuse some items can take.

as to the rest, you've pretty much chosen all the wrong things as the right thing to do.

Your life is worth whatever you're willing to spend or do to preserve it. My standards are clearly higher than yours.

 

[John in AR]

...then there are military standards, i.e. Mil-spec - while you poo-poo all things military...

True, unless it's the 223 cartridge. Then you MUST use the military's choice of gear.

Because... well, nobody knows "because why". So, simple "because".

 

[Dorobuta]

True, unless it's the 223 cartridge. Then you MUST use the military's choice of gear.

Because... well, nobody knows "because why". So, simple "because".

except it has to be some non-existent uber sp round, never is it actually the GI round (whatever that is, last time I checked - 7.62x51 is a GI round)

 

[Garand]

In the 10 years that I competed in IPSC, I met a lot of shooters, both good and bad. I remember gentleman who would drop 2 grand on a 1911 (late '80's), then feed it with $7.00 GI magazines, or run off 200 rds of ammo the night before a match, 3 hour drive away and when they got there, found out that their primers were so high they couldn't close the cylinder. A lot of these people would curse the gunsmith who built the handguns rather than look at their own involvement. I believe that it is my responsibility to eliminate any mechanical problems that I can before a match. If I want my guns to work flawlessly, It's up to me to ensure it. While you can't include part breakage, proper maintenance helps minimize that problem.

A quality gunsmith should be given the benefit of the doubt, a garage parts changer should always be suspect.

Your life is worth whatever you're willing to spend or do to preserve it. My standards are clearly higher than yours.

Best quote I have heard in years.