[Rich Z]

Yeah, I like gadgets and new toys. I've been reading about that 5.7x28mm cartridge and found it rather intriguing. Yeah, I know (or at least I think I know) that there are only two guns that shoot this cartridge, one of which I am likely to never see, much less own. The other is the FN FiveseveN. Ammo isn't all that common, from what I can tell, and certainly there is every chance that this could become a flash in a pan on the marketing stove.

But heck, I still found I was interested in it.

So I had a reptile show in Orlando this past weekend, and as luck would have it, there was also a gun show at the fairgrounds just a few miles away. Things were slow at our reptile show, so the wife was willing to hold down the fort on Sunday while I went on out to the gun show to see what was out there.

I got about three quarters of the way through the show before I spotted at FN FiveseveN on a table. What!?!? Private sale? Price was not bad at all, to boot. Actually cheaper than I thought I would see. But it is a private sale, which means it is used. So did the owner shoot the gun and find it was a dog? So I talked to the guy to see what sort of story line he would give me. Apparently this guy sells assault weapon accessories and had a thriving business on Ebay doing just that. Evidently Ebay pulled the rug out from under him by banning the sale of that merchandise on their site. And just recently, too. So he claimed things got real tough for him, real quickly and right now he just needs some money. He felt the FiveseveN would sell quickly, so that is what he brought to sell. Since this was a Sunday, it obviously did not sell as quickly as he had hoped. He even offered to knock off some $$ from his listed price without my even asking. He said he only fired one clip through it just to make sure it worked OK. He said he is not a target shooter, but the gun shot at point of aim and he felt I would be pleased with it. I don't know, seemed suspicious to me. Sounds like the lies that all dealers will tell you trying to make a sale.

But heck. I guess I could always resell it and get what I paid for it. Maybe. Since there was no probability that I was going to find another one anytime soon as a private sale (no paperwork) and I already did have an interest in this gun, I sprung for it. He sold me the 12 boxes of ammo (minus the one clip's worth) for what worked out to less than $15 per box.

Anyway, today I decided to take that guy outside and see if I could hit the target with it. I set a target out at around 25 yards and set at my bench with three rounds in the clip. Trigger pull isn't anything to brag about. Feels like a two stage trigger with a noticeably click as you take up slack. Release was a little stiff, but broke real cleanly. The gun is mostly plastic with nearly no weight at all to it. Recoil was firm, but pleasant. My wife, over in the building, said it was also VERY loud. Anyway, the three shots I fired were basically dead center on the target about two inches off of the X-ring. I wasn't particularly trying for a group, as I just wanted to see if it would fire and at least hit the target stand.

I loaded up 5 more rounds, this time taking a bit more care with shot placement, and got a fair group of around 2 inches about an inch or so about the X ring. Heck, not bad. At least for me. I am not a precision shooter, so I would say the gun could shoot much better than that with a better driver behind it.

Although the cartridge is rather long for a handgun cartridge, the grip of the FN was not at all unwieldy, even for my small hands. Actually felt very comfortable.

I would have to say that I am pleased with the gun. Haven't fired enough to determine reliability, but I guess any gun can shoot reliably until it breaks. All things said and done, I am glad I bought the gun.

Maybe if this catches on, other guns will start being made in this caliber. A small carbine would probably be interesting, I would think. But I think handguns will be more interesting with this particular cartridge.

Now, I wonder how long it will be before reloading stuff is available?

 

[RIKA]

Interesting post. I've seen a couple of articles about the FiveseveN but never heard a first hand report from someone who actually owns one. Glad your purchase worked out okay. Are the cases boxer primed? What bullet weight does it use (I'm sure its FMJ). What is the weight of the little gun?

Please let us know how things develop with your new prize. Wonder how it kills squirrels.

RIKA

 

[Rich Z]

I found this quote on AltaVista:

Fabrique National FiveSeven:
A rather unusual looking gun, made to fire the new armor piercing SS-190 round. It looks as if it is made entirely from plastic, but although the grip really is all polymer with a few metal inserts, the slide is still steel, covered with plastic. Felt recoil of the pistol is slightly less than 9 mm parabellum and is well ballanced.

The trigger action of the pistol is unusual in that pressure on the trigger first loads the firing pin and then releases the firing pin. This means that unless the trigger is pressed, the pistols firing pin is under no pressure. The weapon is designed with no safety catch due to this.

The gun is meant for military and police use, and wil not be sold to civilian interests. Of note are is the high magazine capacity, 20 rounds, and the calibers long effective range, even in a pistol.

Weight: 1.3 lbs (0.6 kg) (unloaded, double when loaded!)
Caliber: SS-190 (5.7 x 28 mm).
Barrel Length: 4.42 inches (12.25 cm)
Overall Length: 7.8 inches (20.8 cm)
Action: Double Action Only.
Mode of Fire: Semi Automatic only.
Range: 393 ft (120 m).
Magazine: 20 + 1
Cost: $585 to $650
Made in: Belgium.
Special: Only available to government agencies, high magazine capacity, high penetration.

I guess they changed their minds (at least for the moment) about selling to civilians. The gun comes with 10 round magazines.

FN Part number- SS192, Jacketed Hollow Point (JHP).
Duty/Training Hollow Point, we can now sell this to the general public over age 21.
OAL- 1.59"
Bullet wt 28 gr.
Velocity- 2,034 fps
(620 m/s)

Heck, I don't even know if it is Boxer primed. When I go over to the work room, I'll take a look to see. The ammo available to civilians is hollow point, not fmj.

 

[RIKA]

A 28gr HP at 2,032 fps ought to be flat deadly. I read a small blurb on one of the other forums that stated the foreign security police who were issued the FiveseveN were extremely pleased with its terminal performance. This deserves further investigation.

RIKA

 

[Rich Z]

I just took a peek into a fired case and it is definitely boxer primed. To be honest, I didn't even think to ask earlier about it.

 

[Magnum88C]

Last I heard the round was much more effective out of the P90 SMG than the pistol, but that was the SS 190 ammo, not the HP. Does anyone have any actual data on it's terminal performance out of the subgun and pistol?

 

[84 C4]

Wow, sounds like a neat little pistol. How much did you pay for it? If you don't mind my asking.

 

[andy]

same dumb bitch, claims 55 grs, 2200 fps

is nothing, (out of a POCKET gun) NOW says 28 grs at 2050 fps is really great. 28 grs, 20050 fps is a measly 260 ft lbs, dummy,.22 diameter, and it's not across the Mach II barrier, which helps to assure that the temporary cavity has the ability to damage fragile organs, like liver, spleen, lungs. 55 grs, 2200 fps, is 590 ft lbs, dummy. In a BELT gun, the way to go is the 460's 70 grs at 2300 fps. 800 ft lbs, THREE TIMES as powerful as the silly little 5.7, and the FN is NOT a pocket pistol, either.

 

[RIKA]

The dumb bitch thinks a 28 grain HP bullet at 2.032 fps out of a pocket pistol is damn good when you're popping a BG at 15 or 20 yards.

The dumb clown with the flappy lips thinks that a CAR with a 10in barrel is a sniper rifle and is capable of repeatable accuracy at 400, 500, 600 yds. It also can't hit at 100 yds without a bipod.

RIKA

 

[Rich Z]

Just in case any of you people are looking for this 5.7x28mm ammo, so far the cheapest place I have found is Arizona Gun Runner.

But you do have to buy a hefty amount of it.

Just a FYI......

 

[brass hammer]

5.7 jonhson?

fascinating post brother rich! i am truly glad to here of your most recent 'little filly' to your stable.from what i understand it will penetrate a usgi helment @150 meters?:beer:

 

[Rich Z]

I don't think the penetration figures apply to the civilian hollow point ammo. But on the other hand, I am sure the HP stuff would make a mess of soft tissue.

Here's a short blurb about the ammo:

The 5.7x28mm SS190 ammunition has been designed to bridge the gap between the 9mm ammunition and the 5.56 x 45mm. The 9mm FMJ round will not penetrate modern body armor and the 5.56mm (.223 Rem.) rifle ammunition creates over-penetration concerns in a close combat situation or urban warfare. The SS190 has unique design, utilizing two metal inserts. The tip of the ogive has a steel penetrator followed by an aluminum core that is heavier than the forward tip. This causes the bullet to tumble in soft body tissue after 2 inches of penetration. This design virtually eliminates the risk of over penetration. This also creates a large wound cavity and quick incapacitation. The SS190 will perforate 48 layers of Kevlar up to 200 meters when fired from the P90 and achieve the same result up to 50 meters with the Five-seveN handgun. The 5.7 ammunition has only 60% of the recoil impulse of a 9mm. The muzzle velocity of the SS190 is 2,346fps when fired from the P90 and 2,133fps with the Five-seveN. Tracer, Sub Sonic, Training and Blank ammunition available. Ammunition is supplied in the U.S. by Olin.

 

[84 C4]

I think over penetration is almost a non-issue. How much damage can a 5.56 do to another person, IF it can hit another person, after traveling through a human body?

BUT...the conern for over-penetration seems to have led to something interesting. An armor piercing round which tumbles...sounds like the best qualities of the 5.56 and the 5.45 wrapped into a single cartridge, I wonder how well it works...

I vote that Rich should find some and try it out on some ballistic gelatin, wrapped in body armor.

 

[Rich Z]

IF it can be found, I would bet it will be expensive.

Much like the .50BMG Raufoss ammo. Who the heck really wants to shoot ammo that costs $35 a pop? oke:

 

[andy]

since that's a 1 in 50-100 RARITY

of a range, and since the pathetic thing only has 200 ft lbs left out there, and since you aint going to HIT anyone in the chest at that range (while being shot at) it's LAME, just like you are.

 

[andy]

460 Split Nose, 7.8", 28 oz lw Commander

has 600 ft lbs left at that range.

 

[Half elf]

Where would You get this .460 ammo at?, who makes it?, and why do you continue to ramble on about obscure wildcats no one heard of let alone uses?. Would yiou please have the couyrtesy to listen while the adults are talking, and remember that you belong at the little table, so please "Be Seen , But Not Heard":angry:

 

[andy]

so u can't even RELOAD, yet want to

argue gun stuff with ME,punk? U want to buy an entire new GUN, punk, instead of just having a chambered reamed .060" deeper, punk. Gee, aint YOU the gun whiz. want to pay a $ a shot for practice ammo, dummy?

 

[Half elf]

Why must you persist in being such a horse's rump, no one takes your advice, most of us dont want to lose fingers, or worse. You constantly try to reinvent the wheel, and manage to fail everytime. Where do you get the title of anointed one?, and how much did it cost?. I am sorry your life is so empty that the only form of entertainment is insulting strangers in the internet, but try going outside during the day, and be civil to one person, who knows it might work.

 

[andy]

why should I bother, to a bunch of pos?

For the record, I've tried, and these pos's have folowed me here, and dumbasses like YOU take your ignorant cue from THEM, so you are the same type, merit the same treatment from me (or anyone with sense). Yes, dummy, u DO have to know what you are doing, but I advocate NOTHING that's unsafe, just demanding of a bit of skill and care, that's all. I realize that such is well beyond your capabilities, but not everyone is as limited as you are.