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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
but the inept guy, who REALLY DOES NEED a 4wd full of stuff, to last a month (in any season, that is) CAN'T just grab a backpack and go. He doesn't know enough to do so, aint fit enough, aint got the discipline, desire, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
as if an AK has even HALF the range

of the AR 223. :) As if a bolt action had even HALF of the repeat hit speed of an auto rifle. As if you, from a field position, could do even HALF as good as the HBAR's .5 MOA, or even the smithed up BAR'S 1 MOA. :)
 

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Are you so against people loading their car because you are just too young to drive, andy?
 
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Our little friend Andy is going to carry all his worldly goods and his armament in a wheelbarrow according to his former posts.

So much for survival.

SAV
 

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223 fan said:
...as if an AK has even HALF the range of the AR 223...


Ummm... yeah.

68-grain .223 starting @ 3100fps (which is 200 fps above hornady book maximum, but we'll allow for longer barrel this way), and 130-grain 7.62x39 starting @ 2,600fps. (2,600 is the slowest load listed for this weight bullet in the Hornady book.)

Both with 200-yard zero. Now the comparisons:


(400 yards for .223; 200 for AK)



Energy (ft/lbs) AR-625 AK-1197 (AK wins by 91%; almost double.)
Bullet Drop AR-20.5 AK-0.0

For the AR to win at this distance, it would have to start at a good ways over 5,000 fps, likely closer to 6,000; not going to happen.



(600 yards for .223; 300 for AK)


Energy (ft/lbs) AR-387 AK-919 (AK wins by 137%; almost 2 1/2 times.)
Bullet Drop AR-75.3 AK-11.0

Again, not even close. The AK round wins this comparison hands-down.

My point is that while I prefer the AR myself; to say the AK has "less than half the range" is demonstrably incorrect.


For a more apples-to-apples comparison... All the same as above, but testing both at the SAME distance; say 300 yards.


Energy (ft/lbs) AR-783 AK-1186 (Even here, the AK wins out.)
Bullet Drop AR-11.3 AK-8.5


How about 500 yards...?


Energy (ft/lbs) AR-494 AK-532 (Here, the AK fared better than I expected)
Bullet Drop AR-42.5 AK-69.3

Frankly, this surprised me when I looked them up; could be I'm reading something wrong in the book.

For reference, I'm using Hornady Fourth Edition, Vols 1 and 2; from 1997.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
u have to get the HIT, John. Scoping

a .30 AK is a waste of time, and everyone knows it. So the comparison is between the HITS capable of being made by the two guns, not the bs power level that WOULD be applied, IF you COULD get the hit with the AK. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Scoped HBAR'S offer 7" at 700 yds

show me the man who can get 7" at 350 yds, with an iron-sighted ak, hmm? they dont even BOTHER MAKING match grade .30 ak ammo. :)
 

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You know, he does make a good point, if unintentionally. No vehicle is unstoppable and we can't control the universe. I'm all for loading up the bug out vehicle if you can't shelter in place. If you are going to bug out, you might as well take as much as you can to make life and survival easier. However, the person who cannot survive with less than all that stuff may find themselves in more trouble than they can handle. So, by all means, load up and take it with you. If you get to where you are going with everything, so much the better. If not, you best have the skills and ability to survive with what you can carry. Plan B is never as good as plan A, but at least it is a plan.
 

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Why not live in a place that's good to go?

Why live where you have to evacuate?

It's one thing to have a plan and the means of bugging out if you absolutely must, it's another to live in a place where you have to...

Oh, I'm too gimpy to be highly mobile and I know people get injured.

Vehicle, back up vehicle...and staying at home.
 

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Because there is no such place that nothing can happen to make you leave.
 

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as i understand it to "bugout" means things have gotten to hot to stay...here.


well one should be prepaired to "bugout with just a back pack,
but given a little bit of time i would like to have the option of taking a bit more than what i can carry on my back.

truck to pull the jeep till out of diesel, then into the jeep into the back woods were the acts of some who would like to hurt me are very low.

can not get the truck out of town then just the jeep.

maybe on the mt bike.

how about on foot?

maybe the truck and fifth wheel, and jeep in tow???

i do not cut off my options with just a couple deffernt ways to get the he** out of town if needed, but as long as home is good, i will "bugout " at home.

maybe even use the company truck, a reffer van with lots of food. (to sell of course) need money for ammo.

and it will go bad in a week reffer needs fuel. buy it now before it go's on sale:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

.
 

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I believe in a 6 option approach to the problem;


Option 1: Depart ahead of time to a prepared location;
Option 2: If required, stay in place, with stored kit;
Option 3: Departure of area with some sort of vehicle, with a variety of kit
Option 4: Departure of area with 3,200 cu in ruck, rifle, webbing
(prepared for 10+ days)
Option 5: Departure of area with 1,900 cu in patrol pack, rifle, webbing
(prepared for 3-4 days)
Option 6: Departure of area with rifle, webbing
(prepared for 1-2 days)
 

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Sounds like a well thought out, multi-option plan.
I would say you are better prepared than most.
 

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just a little reminder that if you really have to bugout, anything you leave you leave it for the ones that caused the bugout in the first place. so if it came to push come shove and i had to leave my place i'd burn it to the ground i'm not leaving anything useful behind for the scrounging. but in my neighborhood i don't think bugging out is a real worry, most of the guys around hear are really equipted to go for the long haul. well all have radios secondary power systems and lots of ability to use our equipment better than most. i mean like hell my 10 yr old boy can shoot an ak and 1911 better than most full sized men. :cool:
 
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