[andy]

skin, butcher and cut up a deer in an hour, and The great and wonderful Teuf and Rostov CLAIM nobody can do the same with a good steel knife blade. What a load of crap.

 

[Aslan]

I'm willing to bet you cannot do this in 60 seconds, with the rocks that are readily available in the area around where you live.

I beleive you are complete FOS on the ease and the amount of time required. And it must be done using rocks in your AO, that you easily find.

I'll be generous and allow you 2 hours to find the rocks.

Since you claim it is so easy, how about about it?

:devil:

 

[John in AR]

Was this something from one of those “survival” shows; just curious, it sounds like something you saw done.

Case one: You’re right, and it’s doable in a minute. You either have to hope the proper rocks are laying around at the animal kill site for you to use, or you have to pick them up ahead of time, & either make the hand hatchet ahead of time and carry it, or else carry the rocks until needed, and make the hatchet then. It’s easier and lighter to carry a knife, than stones or a stone ax. And it’s much safer to carry a knife than to just hope the right size/type/shape of rocks will be just laying around every time you need them; that’s just way too much of a gamble, especially since it’s so easily avoided by just having a knife in the first place.


Case two: It’s harder than you expect; which I believe is very likely. So you’re then stuck with the problems above, plus having more work than expected. And once complete, if it works well, you’ll probably not want to go through it every time you want to cut something, so you’ll likely end up carrying the stone hatchet. Notice the ancient ones found are usually wrapped with leather, etc, showing that early nomads made one, and kept it; they didn’t make one every time they needed one. Also bear in mind that ancient people (and even native Americans) switched AWAY from stone tools as quickly as they could, once bronze, iron, and steel became available. Again, the knife is easier.


Regarding the “in an hour” thing, a quick & dirty can be done in that time or less, which may be all a person needs if they need to keep moving and/or have no refrigeration. But I admit to never having done a good job on a deer in an hour. There’s a lot of work involved; but “two guys” could be done somewhat quicker.

 

[andy]

The point IS, John, that certain ignorant snobs CLAIM that I can't do the job just FINE with "just" a Skatchet and an SOG multi-tool. The Multitool's got a GOOD steel utility-blade. Just cause I don't NORMALLY carry a $50 pocketknife doesn't mean that a $5 one is what's in the BOB.

 

[Aslan]

You notice, how suddenly, there's a knife in the bob? After all the blustering about how we're stupes for carrying knives, one magically appears in his kit.

Hmm, interesting.

:devil:

 

[Garand]

So post a kit list of what you actually have pack AT THIS MOMENT! Now there is a topic. Plus tell us about your SSI and actually how crippled you are.

 

[Magnum88C]

Sorry Sparky, you said you'd do it with a straight razor, not a pocket knife.

Teuf and Rostov didn't say it COULDN'T be done with a rozro and skatchet, they said it'd be damn difficult to do it.

Wouldn't be THAT easy with a pocket knife either. Why not a cheap skinner (since you, who claims to make $50k a year can't afford anything but the cheapest available) in the bag? A few ounces won't kill you, and if it will, then don't even start on the backpack nomad thing, you won't make it.

 

[mrostov]

The point IS, John, that certain ignorant snobs CLAIM that I can't do the job just FINE with "just" a Skatchet and an SOG multi-tool. The Multitool's got a GOOD steel utility-blade. Just cause I don't NORMALLY carry a $50 pocketknife doesn't mean that a $5 one is what's in the BOB.

You're NOT going to make a decent stone 'hand axe' in 60 seconds. Those that actually do it for real and put some real work into it put some effort into it, AND you have to have the proper type of rock.

I can get the job done also with just my Norlund hatchet and my Leatherman Wave multi-tool if I had to.

BUT, having a decent knife for skinning and dressing out game makes the job a LOT easier, faster, and nicer. Efficiency in the wilds means an increased chance at survival. A person should at the minimum at least have a decent hatchet, a quality multi-tool, and a quality folder, like a Buck 110.

Why handicap yourself? It's not a game.

Think about this: Since you're ultimate concern is 'SHTF', don't you want to be able to get tasks done FAST and with maximum efficiency?

Want to know the best way to dress out and skin game during a crisis? Look at how a poacher would do it. A seasoned poacher won't be dressing out his kill with a multi-tool, guaranteed.

Do you really want to have your muti-tool with all sorts of blood and gunk in it's little crevasses?

I'm not being a snob about it, like you're accusing, but I do know what the difference is between a shit knife and a quality knife. Ask anyone else who's done a fair amount of hunting. they'll tell you the same thing.

Knives that are routinely cheap when new are usually just that, cheap. Their metal and temper is such that they just don't hold an edge well, amongst other things. For example, imitation folding Buck knife copies made in China simply don't last, let alone keep an edge for piss.

Take multi-tools for instance. As good as even the quality ones are, like your SOG and my Leatherman, the knife blades are still usually 420 stainless. They don't hold an edge like other steels and their blades tend to be a bit on the small side and their shape along with the shape of the multi-tool as a handle makes then not the best game knife, especially when there's far better tools for the task.

One of the reasons a lot of experienced woodsmen will routinely wear on their belts both a multi-tool AND a quality folding knife, like a Buck 110, is that knives like the Buck 110 are WAY better for actual field dressing game and similar tasks.

You can't beat the toughness and utility for the task of a good, fixed blade sheath knife, but a folding hunting knife is very handy for packing around on a regular, constant basis. For 'SHTF', I'd be a smart idea to have both handy.

You can get a decent folding hunting knife, like the aforementioned Buck 110, for not too much, usually for well under $30 brand new. Check out Walmart, they usually have a very nice selection of folding knives at great prices.

Gerber has a cool line of woodman's knives called the Freeman series. I'm thinking of trying one of these out. The blades are 440A stainless steel tempered to a hardness of Rc57.

I've also told you repeatedly that you don't need to spend a fortune on knives to have a good one.

One of my favorite knives, a carbon steel hunting & skinning knife with an extremely well tempered 4-3/8" blade, I bought used for $7 on Ebay, but a new replacement would be many, many times more than that. You should check out the Ebay knife market, it's pretty vast and some smoking good deals can be had.

A hatchet is fine, but I've expressed my doubts in the past concerning the 'Skatchet' for several reasons, especially the weak handle scheme. Hatchet and axe handles take a tremendous amount of stress and abuse. You need something that is tough.

I've seen old Norlund heads on Ebay for $20 and you can get a Gransfors that will last and last. You can also get a reasonably priced Eastwing at Home Depot. Hard to get tougher than an Eastwing since the handle and the head are all one forged piece.

 

[mrostov]

Here's an example of what I'm talking about. Pictured below is a Leatherman Wave and a Buck 112 Ranger.

The blade on the Wave is fairly representative of what you find on most plier type multi-tools. The Buck 112 has a 3" blade and is a shorter version of the Buck 110 which has 3-3/4" blade.

Now even though the Buck 112 and the Leatherman Wave have overall closed lengths and closed widths that are roughly the same (they can fit the same size nylon pouch), and the blades are the same length, which blade would you rather have for efficiently dressing out some food animal that you just killed?

Also take note that since the Buck's intended main purpose is a knife for cutting and slicing, and the Leatherman's intended main purpose is a multi-tool; the carbon content and temper on the knife blades is different.

The Leatherman's knife blade was meant to take abuse and not break while doing all sorts of stuff from short cutting jobs to scraping gaskets.

The Buck's blade, on the other hand, while probably not as all purpose break resistant as the Leatherman's blade, will hold it's edge probably 6 to 8 times longer than the Leatherman while doing a lengthy cutting and skinning job while dressing out some animal. The blade on the Buck is also shaped better for such tasks.

Another thing to also take note of is THIS: That particular Buck 112 has been in constant use since the 1970's. It still opens smooth, still locks up tight, and can still take and keep an edge as sharp as a razor blade.

This is why you want to buy a quality knife.

Some POS Chinese made knock-off might have lasted maybe a week to a month of strenuous use, if that. I've personally seen them fail even faster than that. This genuine Buck knife has seen an incredible amount of use over almost 3 decades. The only thing that time and use has worn out on it was the original leather sheath.

 

[Dorobuta]

It is painfully clear Andy/Boati/? Has no real field craft and no real experience in the wild.