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Discussion Starter #1
I came across this list some time ago. It makes a lot of sense if you're putting togather a [/b][/i]BOB[/i][/b]. What do you think of it?

1. Defense against Violence, i.e. your firearms, your knives and support gear. It would vary as to the expected threat level, as to being No.1 or lower on the chain. The threat could be immediate, or distant. You don't need 1,000 rounds in the Hurricane shelter, though a pistol in the belt, or a rifle or shotgun in the bag, is a good idea.

2. Shelter and protection against the elements. This can be your clothing, poncho, Ranger Roll, sleeping bag, whatever. You must avoid hypothermia at all costs. You can die in minutes from hypothermia, or in better climates, it is not an issue at all. Also consider shelter from heat exhaustion, a hat.

3. Water. Avoiding dehydration. This can be the water carried on you, and purification systems for making the water you find, potable. You can die in three days, or so, without water.

4. Food. Avoid starvation; keep your energy levels high. It takes many weeks to starve, but not too long to become sluggish due to hunger/malnutrition.

5. Sanitation. Having Dysentery will knock you out of a fight, or flight, very rapidly. Hordes of soldiers used to die from disease, rather than wounds, in earlier centuries. Studies by Russians showed that an ungodly percentage of the food and water resources in Grozny, during the fighting there in the early '90's, was contaminated with fecal material. Wash your hands and utensils, purify your water.

6. Transportation. Boots, really. Blisters from ill-fitting boots will REALLY slow you down. Putting your junk on a bike, and pushing it, will help you transport your gear with less punishment to your body, as well. Of course, the good old 4X4 truck is handy too. Just have a full gas tank.

7. Information. Maps, Binoculars, GPS, Compass, etc. Without knowing where you are going, it's darned hard to get there. Also, handy to know what is in your immediate path.

8. Communications. Radios, chem lights, smoke, whatever. If you are with others, or others expect you, then you had better have a reliable way to communicate with them, or you have a recipe for disaster.

Of course, all of this has LOTS of room for personal taste, needs of the local AO, and budget. More of a base to begin from, and then fill in as you go. Every AO is different, and not all emergencies are SHTF. Best to have flexibility, and be able to add/discard (or at least de-emphasize) things based upon the immediate situation.
 

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A good medical and dental kit is a 'must have'.

Good post Bill.

RIKA
 

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Thanks, Bill.
 

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I think of the BOB as the basic life support.

So it needs to be easily backpacked and set up for long term outdoor living.

If I had to bug it would be in one Jeep and two 4x4, 3/4 ton Ford Powerstroke, crewcab pick-ups (that have "fuel and tool" boxes in the bed) with stock trailers half filled with horses (saddled) and half with the gear packed in panniers.

We'll drive till we can't, dismount the stock and press on, something happens to the horses we tighten boot laces and shoulder BOB packs and press on.

I think of bug-out shit as being layered.

Anyone that considers themself a "survivalist" should already know what basic, personal gear they need to get buy in thier neck of the woods though several trips a year just out recreatin,scouting, hunting, fishing ect.

Teuf,
 

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I am waiting for the tard to tell us how we know noth9ign about this and a childs sleeping bag, a couple of trash bags and his BArney backpack are all you really need.

HOwever we all know better than that don't we.

Hmmm what about a thread on the actual contents of our BOB's?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Raider said:
A good medical and dental kit is a 'must have'.

Good post Bill.

RIKA
Absolutely needed, RIKA.
 

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Mabu agrees this is a good idea must have stuff ready now.

Mabu believes in layering clothing to cut down on weight somewhat.
 

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Mabu Khan said:
Mabu believes in layering clothing to cut down on weight somewhat.
Though I have my own ideas, what are Mabu's ideas on layering clothing.

RIKA
 

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Hard cold currency is also a good idea for a survival kit. I do mean hard too, like gold and silver or platinum. Gold being the best, followed bgy silver if only because most folks would not realize the value of platinum or know how to tell if it was even near real. Even if the SHTF in a total beserko world scenario, it would probably be amazing just how many people would be attracted to bright shiny metals.
 

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My take on gold, etc, is that in a big collapse it will take a while for them to have value - food, ammo, etc will probably be barter items of choice.

Once things settle down, then the gold will have value again...

But will take getting to the point where people know they will survive first.

I'm not saying not to have them, just that initially they will be of low survival value.

:devil:
 

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I'm not sure that I would barter ammo except to someone I trusted. Cigarettes might be a possibility. Dad has a big vacuum can of cigarette tobacco along with the rolling papers up in one of the kitchen cabinets (his "lifesaver" from before he quit smoking). Been up there for years so maybe its no good any more.

RIKA
 

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Commerce of any kind SHTF is just two risky IMO, till things get way settled down, better have what you need now. Talk about a security nightmare and exposing your group to danger, trying to arange some kind of trade would be a mess. If I have to bug out I'm keeping strangers at a very polite distance of at least BSZ. Everyone you come into contact with will be a risk to be managed, from the standpoint of them knowing where you are and what you have and what kind of security you are running ect.

IMO if there are folks around wating to trade you need to find a better place to set up.

Better to have your fuel for a bug-out now, you can see what a nightmare gas stations become and the same goes with food and other supplies. Let the unprepared wait in line 6 hours for a tank of fuel, you can be well on your way in that time frame.

Same with groceries, have it and have it packed, grocery store scenes from current storms should be all the warning a survivalist needs to get his stuff now.

Call me anti-social if ya want, but I am taking no chances with stangers and am going to do everything im my power to not have to deal with them on any level.

Teuf,
 

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I don't disagree with anything any of you have posted in this regard, and I agree you had better be prepared and ready to not need to barter with anyone.

While there are risks when encoutering others, at some point it will be necessary if society is to ever re-emerge from whatever happened...

:devil:
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Aslan said:
My take on gold, etc, is that in a big collapse it will take a while for them to have value - food, ammo, etc will probably be barter items of choice.

Once things settle down, then the gold will have value again...

But will take getting to the point where people know they will survive first.

I'm not saying not to have them, just that initially they will be of low survival value.

:devil:
When Mel Tappan was alive, I used to argue that point with him.

I think your point is right Tim, and Tappan had the opinion that gold would be an absolute value in an economic collapse.
 

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Problem with gold is, event eh 1/4 ounce coins are EXPENSIVE. You can buy a LOT of shit with that same money, and you're almost never going to get what it was "worth" (i.e. cost) after SHTF. SOME, might be ok, but for coinage, I'd rather go with silver.

But really, I think it'll be more of a barter situation for a fairly long time.
As for trading ammo. . .I don't think that .22 ammo will be a bad trade. unlike CowardKid's fantasies, rimfires really aren't that great for commando operations. To avoid the whole, buy ammo, kill the guy and steal the rest, scenario, simply make it clear policy that they are to NOT load their weapon until they make it to (whatever your designated point is), or they will be shot without warning. In a post-SHTF I would imagine that a single-shot .22 and a box of shell, would be worth more than their weight in gold.

But I think RIKA has the idea. The most sought-after commodities will be luxuries. A can of tobacco and roll-yer-own papers is a good idea (especially with the price of pre-made smokes these days). Booze, and better yet, the know-how and equipment to make it, will be a big seller (always has been). Oh, and don't forget. . .that 500,000 rolls of Charmin will sell fast. Hell, bubble gum, hard candies, playing cards, books, etc are all good trading stock.

See, people aren't really going to be in combat 24/7 and will naturally try and bring as much "normalcy" back to their lives as possible.

Teuf, I doubt you'd be THAT antisocial, I always pictured the sign in front of casa de Teuf to look something like this:
 

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I'm a testy fucker when my loved ones are on the line Mag.

Just think how a trade would have to go.

You would need security, they would have security, you don't trust them, they don't trust you everybodies sweaty, twitchy finger is massaging a trigger. Most folks don't have experience at such things and most won't have good com with thier guy doing the trading. There will be many true and false stories of folks being slaughtered for thier supplies. You reach in your pit to scratch a flea and the shooting starts.

What kind of chances are you willing to take?

Who are you going to send into the kill zone to exchange the goods and work the deal?

You going to arange a trade and come back later?

Maybe to a spot they have prepared an ambush?

I'll go without before I'm trading with stangers at least till things have calmed way down.

Teuf,
 

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Actually, what I said was kind of tongue in cheek. Excuse to post the book cover, really.

As far as real trades. . .One person at a time can come up, I suppose. Others put on notice that any others approaching get shot without warning?

Not trusting anyone only goes so far. Eventually you WILL have to trade. Maybe it's a good thing to think these things out now?
 

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I like the book cover, it's good stuff Mag :)

I'm not suggesting being a recluse forever, it's just that the risk out weigh the gain in the short term. I would trade with folks I know, I would just be damm cautious and be ready to kill them in a heartbeat if things looked jiggy. I would rather avoid those games.

One of the twitchyest military manuvers is a "passage of line" thats when friendlies pass though friendly lines. It should be simple but it's a very scarey thing for everyone involved, just ask anyone thats done it.

Bartering would be the same way, there are so many things that could happen and they happen awful fast. They have too go fast, you only get one go-around with something like that. You hesitate and your person is going to die, you go too soon and somebody else is dead for no other reason than scratching a sunburn. Once the drama kicked into gear you wouldn't get it shut down, everybody is going to be shooting. Bad deal alll the way and around better to be avoided.

Teuf,
 

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Yeah, ok, if you're talking short-term, I agree. Let things settle first. At least until you get the minefield setup. . .:dgrin:
 

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Garand,
A detailed listing of our BOB could be provided after we complete our annual inventory of all our BOB and stores. The actual list used was lost with a HD failure and had not been regenerated to date.
But here's the list right out of my son's BSA manual and I'll add to it from memory.
BSA:
Backpack
Rain cover for backpack
sleeping bag (seasonal)
sleeping pad (seasonal)
ground cloth
Food for # of days hiking/camping (plus 1 meal)
eating kit (MISURP E GE aluminum with hard plastic utensils)
toiletries (soap, toothbrush, towel, washcloth, toothpaste)
Pocketknife
first aid kit on steriods (extra items added to round it out)
extra clothing
rain gear (IE poncho, at a minimum)
water bottle (30 oz)
flashlight (w/extra batteries)
trail food
fire starters (Blastmatch)
sun protection
Bug repellent
map & compass
water purification tablets
sewing kit
hatchet (wife and son, I carry a gerber liteweight axe)
50 ft nylon cord
alcohol stove (made from coke can)
alcohol fuel
40 oz Hydration bladder with hose tied to backpack straps
Camp shoes (Lite weight "surf shoes" or sandles for around camp which allows your boots to dry out, and allows you to cross streams while protecting your feet and keeping your hiking boots dry)

**in a summer configuration the above pack weighs approximatly 38 pounds for a two night camp out carrying dehydrated foods. A winter pack would be approximately 5 pounds heavier (additional foods to fuel your body) but also includes a one man shelter**

For BOB we added:
Gear "first aid" kit
bleach (sml amount for various uses)
extra socks
Emergency rations (1 Mayday 3600 calorie bar = 3 days food)


For BO purposes we each have one LBH w/following attachements:
One MILSURP "field medical kit" (pressure bandages etc...)
One MILSURP Canteen (never have enough water)
Two MILSURP M16 ammo pouches (various types of ammo fits in them, from boxes of 22 LR to 7.62x39mm 10 rd stripper clips, 80 rounds per pouch for the 39mm and hundreds of the 22LR)
One K-bar Knife
One MILSURP compass pouch containing:
*1 ceramic knife sharper
*1 Blast match firestarter
*3 chemical fire starters
*1 Gerber multi-tool

Firearms per person:
One rifle
one sidearm
* all weapons are those that we shoot and use at least monthly.*

Shelter is not mentioned because in the summer my son would use his one man tent, my wife the other (both 4 pounders) and I would be in my hennssey hammock (2 pounds). But during a winter BO we would carry the family winter tent, with me packing the bulk of the tent (approx. 15 pounds) while mom and son carried the stakes, ground cloth, and poles in their packs.

There is still room in the packs, and I figure that if we can either use it to stash the LBH's in the packs so we blend in better, or to pile in extra food until we each reach our maximum carry weight. Which equates to allot of Ramen noodles and spices! With one or two cans of fruit for desert.

Again, this is from memory I'm sure I've forgotten an item or two...

Hunter

Edited to add: Maximum TESTED carrying weight for my wife and son is 50 pounds each, and 75 pounds for myself. But at these weights we're not moving very fast and would be wore out (and were) at the end of the day.
 
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