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Discussion Starter #1
for the 11 years he survived in the Idaho wilds, with no gun. No cabin, no axe, no saw. A blanket, a coffee pot, a skillet, a bit of fishline, a pocket knife. Gee, that must NEVER have happened, because he had NO compass or maps. :) Everyone KNOWS you HAVE to have compass and maps, you just CAN'T "make it". Well I say crap. Where you going in such a big hurry? If you can survive ANYWHERE, what difference does it make if you don't get to a given place in a week, or a month or a year, hmm? What diff does it make if you never BOTHER to go there at ALL? Foraging is possible anyplace I would go, that's certain. If can't forage on the way there, WHY GO?

See, bozos just ASSUME that you HAVE to go to a certain place, by a certain time, but if it's shtf survival, that's pure bs. When there's no such need, there aint a lot of use for a compass, much less a map, andyou can EASILY BE FORCED to go places you AINT got a map for. A lot of use that topo map of Utah is, when you've had to flee to Wyoming, eh? Asswipe paper, that's ALL it is.
 

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Moreland had mental problems and he had a sleeping bag.

Moreland also suffered hideously and admitted that he lacked many things that he felt he could really have used.
 

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Gunkid, if the balloon ever goes up, the sun will rise in the morning, the sun will set at night. Crops will have to be sown at a designated time, and harvested at a designated time. After spring comes winter, those who have not had the foresight to prepare for the change in seasons, very well will die.

Just because you have no place to go and want to live and die like an animal, doesn't mean the rest of us do. Just because you don't have the ability with your tunnel vision to see a need for a map and compass, doesn't mean we don't. You can't even pack a basic rucksack! And yes, if you feel no longer a need for a map, it could be used for toilet paper. But a map just might show you where there is a potential to find more toilet paper and the compass will show you the direction to follow.
 

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erika/gunkid, have you considered a little field test? Come January, why don't you spend a night out doors with your mylar bag, in the back yard?
 

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Yeah, that should be a doable test with a comfy safety net to boot. There should be no reason that it cannot be done.

I'd like to see his wife drop him off 20 miles from home so he has to REALLY try and survive an evening with just his mylar - sink or swim. Not being able to run his freezing ass into the house for a warm up should drive the point home.
 

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andy said:
<sniip>

See, bozos just ASSUME that you HAVE to go to a certain place, by a certain time, but if it's shtf survival, that's pure bs. When there's no such need, there aint a lot of use for a compass, much less a map, andyou can EASILY BE FORCED to go places you AINT got a map for. A lot of use that topo map of Utah is, when you've had to flee to Wyoming, eh? Asswipe paper, that's ALL it is.
Ah, Yes, the NUTTY JOHN, the BACKYARD SURVIVALIST :nope: gives the forum the benefits of his YEARS of INEXPERIENCE.
 

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andy said:
for the 11 years he survived in the Idaho wilds, with no gun. No cabin, no axe, no saw. A blanket, a coffee pot, a skillet, a bit of fishline, a pocket knife. Gee, that must NEVER have happened, because he had NO compass or maps. :) Everyone KNOWS you HAVE to have compass and maps, you just CAN'T "make it". Well I say crap. Where you going in such a big hurry? If you can survive ANYWHERE, what difference does it make if you don't get to a given place in a week, or a month or a year, hmm? What diff does it make if you never BOTHER to go there at ALL? Foraging is possible anyplace I would go, that's certain. If can't forage on the way there, WHY GO?
Moreland was a mental case (litterally) that lived a really miserable existance, lost most of his teeth, and if he was lacking gear, that only means that he was unable to steal the item in question.

andy said:
See, bozos just ASSUME that you HAVE to go to a certain place, by a certain time, but if it's shtf survival, that's pure bs.
Oh really, what if you know that you have to make a certain mountain pass before the first snowfall. You also have to know where the mountain passes are.

andy said:
When there's no such need, there aint a lot of use for a compass, much less a map, andyou can EASILY BE FORCED to go places you AINT got a map for. A lot of use that topo map of Utah is, when you've had to flee to Wyoming, eh? Asswipe paper, that's ALL it is.
Even if you didn't have a map of Wyoming, that map of Utah probably made sure you got there.

Getting a good road map of Wyoming would probably be pretty easy once you got there. Just look in the remains of any convenience store, gas station, roadside diner, truck stop, abandoned car, etc.

The amount of info on just a regular motorist's road map is actually quite extensive, especially for planning routes and long distance land navigation.

Meanwhile, the map that you had to get there, with your notes on it, becomes a valuable source of information both for yourself and/or to barter to others.

You don't have to carry 1000 super detailed topos. In my personal bugout gear I keep an assortment of AAA road maps for several states. Since I'm right in the middle of a very large state, I also keep two atlas books handy, a DeLorme topo atlas for AZ and a Benchmark road and recreation atlas for AZ. In the inside map pocket of my LBV I keep several maps handy. We also have a satchel full of maps and more topo atlases for the general bug out and camping gear. I have accurate maps that can get me to British Columbia, the Gulf of Mexico, etc.

Unlike you, we actually travel and camp, so our gear get's used, is ready to go, and we know what works and what doesn't. We're ahead of the curve while you're still stumbling around in the dark, afraid to even go backpacking to try out the gear you don't have.
 

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mrostov said:
Moreland had mental problems and he had a sleeping bag.

Moreland also suffered hideously and admitted that he lacked many things that he felt he could really have used.
Sounds like Moreland and gunkid have something in common. And if gunkid is stupid enough to go around killing he will find out real quick that he really does have to be someplace else but without the knowledge of how to get there.

Say did any of you see BAT21 and how the Lt. Col. used a map and compass to avoid bad terrain so he could get to a better LZ? Now that was a true story and not some gunkid SHTF fantacy.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
u think I AINT tested the mylar, REPEATEDLY, asshole? I LIVED in a van, for 2 winters, back in Illinois. If you dress right to sit arounnd, in a given temp, you can definitely sleep at that temp, inside the Mylar bag, inside the 2 poncho tent, in the hammock, on the ground sheet. See, stupid, the Velcro around the edges lets you open a hole at top and bottom, and "fluff" the bag a couple of times. Presto, out goes any air containing retained moisture. Your body heat quickly warms the fresh air in the bag, and you go back to sleep. Wearing thermax longjohns and Gore Tex cammies inside the bag, you stay pretty dry even if you dont' periodically refresh the air in it. You are just too fucking lazy to make such a bag and find OUT the truth, just like you are all too fucking lazy to make some split nose bullets and work up some loads for them.

I"ve spent a LOT more nights out in the cold than YOU have, count on that.
 

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Living in a van, is not living in the bush during winter. Because of normal day to day activity in the bush your clothes get wet, even if you wear gortex. Your socks are normally soaked if not from snow or slush you have sweat. They have to come off your body in order to dry or your core body temperature will go down.. Therefore your mylar is useless as you have no inner "lining". Any idiot can have a comfortable night in a dry van, even in the winter. Your just too fucking stupid to realize that sleeping in a van because your homeless is far different than a night in the bush after you have been humping a ruck all day.
 

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andy said:
I"ve spent a LOT more nights out in the cold than YOU have, count on that.
No you haven't.

You should listen to Garand on this. He's dead right and probably has the most cold weather experience out in the field of anyone here.

I can tell just by what you're saying that you have virtually ZERO field experience and have never really been seriously backpacking. Otherwise you'd know better than to say some of the stuff that you do. Even a single decent backpack trip, like a week in the Sierras, will dramatically re-adjust about 99.9999% of what you try and espouse for 'backpack survival'.

You really shouldn't have backed out on the trip with Teuf. It would have done wonders for you.

Sorry to break this to you, but sleeping in a van ISN'T really 'roughing it out in the cold'. You got too used to climate control and central heating at your Federal facility over the years.

Actually, it's a LONG ways from roughing it out in the cold. Vehicles are actually pretty good shelter. What you basically had was a cabin without a wood stove.

Inside the WELL PROTECTED SHELTER of a van is an example of the environment where space blankets will do some good.

If you think that your van experience means you have experience in the field you are in for one hell of a surprise.

BTW, you'll find that out in the field a space blanket offers absolutely ZERO protection from ANY wind and even the slightest trace of wind will negate any benefit you can derive from it.

As for your hammock and 2 poncho tent, that might work in Hawaii, but in ANY serious cold weather that has got to be one of all time miserable shelter clusterfucks, especially if it's snowing outside.

You'll find that even a halfway decent dome tent can be had that offers 10000X more protection and really doesn't weigh much more. Your space blanket will also work in a dome tent a LOT better.
 

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Yeah, the mylar might be acceptable in that case. What you don't understand is that sleeping in a VAN, the VAN provides the wind protection the mylar won't, and sleeping on a ground mat in a VAN, helps keep the thing from getting torn up. But YOU, wanting to be the Backpack Nomad, won't have any of the protection of the VAN in your "heavy cover". "Heavy cover" = myriad of things to tear the mylar to shreds, THE FIRST NIGHT.
 

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But the mylar will prevent freezer burn and keep him nice and preserved, so in 5000 years or there abouts, when they chisel him out of the glacier, they can look upon his odd little, chopped down aluminum weapon with the ceremonial attachment on the end and ponder if he was some sort of mystical shaman.

Never having hear the term 'Gunkid' before, by mere coincidence they decide to dub him, 'Icekid'.
 

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I'm no expert on Mooreland, but I thought he also had a rifle and shells he'd stolen along the way, at least for part of his time out. Single-shot .22, iirc...?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
yes, AFTER doing without one, for the first 11 years, as I said in the starting post of this thread.
 

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mrostov said:
<snip>

Never having hear the term 'Gunkid' before, by mere coincidence they decide to dub him, 'Icekid'.
:roflmao1: :roflmao1: :roflmao1:
 

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Aslan said:
I think the term is stupesicle...


:devil:
:nyah: :nyah: :nyah: NUTTY JOHN!
 

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andy said:
Moreland's survival gear totaled about 10 lbs for the 11 years he survived in the Idaho wilds, with no gun. No cabin, no axe, no saw.
I didn't realize 'the 11 years' was 'the first 11 years'.

I thought you meant he survived for 11 years in the wilds, and he had no gun, as in "it was only 11 years total". And I'm not picking a fight, grammatically, both interpretations are correct.

Told you I was no expert on Mooreland. :cool:
 
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