[andy]

AVERAGE hitting 10" at 6m, with pistol from low ready. TRY reacting, hitting that fast with shotgun,from low ready. TRY working a pump, moving over, hitting ANOTHER guy, same range, say, 5 ft apart, in the .30 second in which it can be done (to hit CHEST with the pistol, just hit TORSO with pump gun. 20 ft is a LONG shot in most homes. Most rooms aren't 20 ft, kitty corner, nor will most guys be pressed back into those corners. pump shotgun can't even beat a PISTOL, at typical indoor stuff.

 

[Aslan]

you conveniently ignore semi-auto shotguns and compare a pump to a semi-auto psitol.


:devil:

 

[andy]

much less be at HAND when needed, like a pistol can ALWAYS be.

 

[Glenn Bartley]

Do you even know what the low ready combat postion is with a shotgun? If you did, then you would realize that you can bring the shotgun to combat ready and fire as quickly as or quicker than you can the pistol at a range of 20 feet. Of course you sound as if you would start shooting when the weapon was brought up to an aiming point. Anyone who knows anything about firing in a situation where the pistol or shotgun had been at low ready knows that you begin to fire as you are raising the weapon when in very close range (such as your 5 foot example) and no bystanders are apt to be wounded. (Why would you be in low ready at 5 feet from a dirtbag anyhow with either the pistol or the shotgun - especially the pistol? No excuse for a bad tactical error like that unless your are just plain dumb.) This is called vertical tracking. It can be very effective on hard flooring surfaces especially with buck shot and even with pistol ammo - but you would not know about that would you.

Now think again, how about an assailaint who is 20 yards away and you have to aim with the pistol. You loose with your pistol almost guaranteed. You have little or no combat smarts at all. Good grief, are you trying to get people killed or do you just have a death wish for yourself? :headbang:

 

[andy]

I NEVER said 5 ft, stupid. You better NOT let a guy get within 5 ft of you, when you have a longarm, stupid. If you do, you will be WRASSLING with him over control of the longarm, stupid. Learn how to READ, stupid. The 5 ft was between 2 targets, stupid, at 20 ft range, stupid, and hip shooting, under stress, means MISSING, stupid. You are stupid enough to 'think" that getting all "set" with your body is how it will go when it's for BLOOD, stupid. When it's for real, the odds are quite high that you will have to PIVOT, or at least swing the gun around, stupid. then your point shooting bs, from the hip, is EASILY proven to be NO faster than shouldering the pc, stupid. 5 out of 5 tries, AVERAGED, for GOOD hits, stupid.

 

[Magnum88C]

You probably think "WRASSLING" is a word don't you?

A very fast and accurate enough way to use a shotgun in across-the-room engagements is to hold the buttstock under your armpit, barrel held parallel to your side, and use your torso as a turret, turning with your hips, not shoulders. You might just be surprised how quickly and easily you can get good torso hits.

 

[Glenn Bartley]

Ooooh did I make a mistake reading your post. Oooh, I have had plenty of guys less than 5 feet away while I had a long arm. I know how to control it, and I know where it goes if I have to cuff them. I know how to properly use a tactical sling. You want to try me. I will have those cuffs on your Black Belted fat body in no time. And so if it was 20 feet so what, all the better for the guy with the long arm. As I said why not go to 20 yards, or better yet to 100. Your tactical knowledge base is rather faulty as I see it. My guess is you read lots of it in magazines or books from articles by experts but you just don't get it right when you attempt to comprehend it ot pass it on. All of my info in that earlier post holds true at 20 feet, or at 20 yards.