Firearm Forums - Arms Locker banner

1 - 7 of 7 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
average, draw and hit 12" circle, 7 yds, from a totally insecure open front rig, hand start was hand "hovering" just off of the gun butt. That was Red Jones, IIRC, until Bill French FINALLY got lucky, and got 5 straight hits, 1 handed point shooting, with his 6" M10 revolver, an open front rig, after missing at least once, 7 years in a row. The SWPL would have the Leatherslap once a year, ya see. After Bill posted his .57 record, the League retired the Leatherslap as a match. It's REAL easy to miss a 12" disk at 7 yds, moving that fast, from a secure rig, but the open front saves you at least .10 second in draw time, because you just shove the gun forward out of the rig, into your waiting weak hand. For the same size mark and range, starting hands at sides, and a secure speed rig, .70 second would probably be a luck average, considering match stress. Miss just once, take another .20 second to hit it, and you just added .04 second to your average time, ya see. What you can do in practice, and what you can do in top level competion, rarely have much in common. :) In fact, if you can consistently deliver 90% of your practice ability, in top level matches, you are one of the top 20 men in the world, at combat pistol shooting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,840 Posts
When the world championships only encompass about 20 some odd people in the world, its not hard to be a world competitor. 1977 was almost 28 years ago.

So how did you shoot in the Nationals in 1979, 1980? 1981? 1982? 1983? 1984? 1985? 1986? 1998? Well tell the rest of the story about your IPSC career!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
549 Posts
Times sure have changed. None of this hovering over the gun, or creeping. Now the default position in IPSC is arms hanging naturally at sides, in Steel Challenge it's wrists above respective shoulders. Must of changed the rules to keep guys from cheating the buzzer with such a small distance to travel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
The rules changed about all that with the intro of IPSC in 1977, actually. The SWPL Leatherslap is what STARTED Cooper's combat shooting study, way back in 1950's. So it continued as a tradition in the SWPL, and was even accepted as one of the 3 matches you had to choose (out of 5-6, I forget) to get your "Master" title". They just shot it as a "non IPSC sanctioned" course of fire. I got an open front, and within a few hours I was averaging times in the .40's for a one hand point shot, and in the 50's for a Weaver. I was going to go set a record the year after SWPL stopped the match. They "thought" nobody was EVER going to beat Bill's .57 luck average. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Leatherslaps pretty much died out in the .70's, cause nobody wanted to try moving really fast, from a secure rig and from hands at surrender, I suppose. It IS a bit dangerous, especially if you are using an FBI rig. Even with the speed rig, it's very possible to "catch" the muzzle of the gun as you try to move it forward, on the lip of the holster, and turn the muzzle back down towards your foot. Ray Chapman's Walk and Draw rig was seen to have a bullet hole in the front of the holster, ya know. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
549 Posts
I went out after work (I get off early) and tried some draws ith my hand hovering just above the grip. It makes a world of difference in comparison to hands in surrender. I was getting draws in the .60-.70 range on a 18X24 gong at 7 yards. Still a far cry from a .62 average on a target half that size.

At least now I know I am slow getting to the gun from surrender position. Thanks for helping me diagnose a problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,117 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
We had a leatherslap at columbia in '78, then had goof-off session, using hand hover start position. Ron Bright beat me with a .57, I got a .58, luck hit for me, 18"x24", at 10 yds, one hand point. :) I beat Ron in the match itself, because I went to Weaver, and because he didn't have his grip safety pinned down, and his grip didn't depress it. I noticed he beat me, didn't fire, so I looked at him, and then fired without looking back at my gun. I hit the target, and that was that. The time was terrible, but it was man vs man.:)
 
1 - 7 of 7 Posts
Top